Sir SYDNEY HENN asked the Under-Secretary of State for the Colonies whether Southern Rhodesia is to be included in the purview of the East Africa Commission on closer union?

Mr. ORMSBY-GORE: No change is contemplated in the Terms of Reference already laid down, but arrangements have been made for the Commission to stay a few days at Salisbury for the purpose of conferring with the Government of Southern Rhodesia.

Sir S. HENN asked the Secretary of State for the Colonies what route has been mapped out for the East Africa Commission on Closer Union; when it is expected to leave this country for East Africa; and how long it is expected to be absent on its mission?

Mr. ORMSBY-GORE: The Commission will leave this country on the 22nd December and will travel to Uganda via Trieste, Cairo, Khartoum and the Nile. It will then proceed from Uganda to Kenya, Tanganyika Zanzibar, Nyasaland and Northern Rhodesia. It will spend a few days at Salisbury in Southern Rhodesia en route for Livingstone and will return from Cape Town. It is not yet possible to say how long the Commission will be absent.

10th November.

SECRETARY OF STATE FOR DOMINION AFFAIRS (Tour).

Sir H. BRITTAIN asked the Under-Secretary of State for the Colonies what further sections of the Empire are to be visited by the Secretary of State for Dominion Affairs; what time he is to spend in each; and when he is expected back in England?

Mr. ORMSBY GORE: The Secretary of State for Dominion Affairs, who is also Secretary of State for the Colonies, arrived in Australia on the 10th October, and will, according to present plans, leave for New Zealand on the 17th November, reaching New Zealand on the 27th November. He will sail for British Columbia on the 20th December, and it is anticipated that the ship in which he sails will call for a few hours at Suva in the Fiji Islands. He will be in Canada from the 5th January until the 3rd or 10th February, and he may be expected in England a week later.

KENYA (MASAI CATTLE).

Mr. JOHNSTON asked the Secretary of State for the Colonies whether the proceeds of the sale of the Masai cattle deposited in a trust fund have yet been spent upon works of benefit for the Masai tribes; and whether he will call for a Report from the Kenya Government as to the benefit which has accrued to the Masai from this expenditure?

Mr. ORMSBY-GORE: I have no information on this point, and will ask for a Report as suggested.

MASAI TRIBE (ARMS)..

14th November.

Mr. SNELL asked the Under-Secretary of State for the Colonies when orders were given by the Governor of Kenya Colony to disarm the Masai tribe of their fighting spears; and the number of the members of this tribe who, since they were deprived of the means of defence which their spears provided, have been attacked and injured by wild beasts?

Mr. ORMSBY-GORE: I am not aware that any general order has been given by the Governor of the nature indicated, but by the Native Authority Ordinance the headman is empowered either of his own motion or under the orders of a senior commissioner of district commissioner to prohibit or restrict the carrying of arms, and such an order was in fact made in 1922 upon one of the Masai tribes as a punishment for certain thefts and murder. I have no reason to suppose that this exercise of authority has led to the consequences suggested.

NATIVE LAND TRUST.

Colonel WEDGWOOD asked the Under-Secretary of State for the Colonies whether he is yet in a position to announce the conditions and membership of the proposed native land trust for Kenya Colony?

Mr. ORMSBY-GORE: No, Sir. This matter was further discussed with the Governor shortly before his departure from this country, and I am awaiting the further draft legislation which was to be prepared after his return to the Colony.

Colonel WEDGWOOD : Will that also await the recommendations of the Commission?

Mr. ORMSBY-GORE: No. The matter was fully discussed between my right hon. Friend and the existing Government.

ROAD WORK (WOMEN AND CHILDREN).

Mr. KELLY asked the Under-Secretary of State for the Colonies whether he is now in a position to make any statement upon the alleged employment of children and women in Kenya Colony for the making and upkeep of roads?

Mr. ORMSBY-GORE: The Acting Governor of Kenya has reported that the compulsory employment of women and children on road work, or indeed on any form of labour, is not allowed by the Colonial Government and that no such labour has been called out at any time. It has occasionally happened that male natives, on being called up for labour on the maintenance of roads under the Native Authority Ordnance, send out women and children in their place; but it is an express standing instruction that, in such an event, the women and children should at once be sent back by the person in charge of the work and the defaulting male prosecuted.

Mr. KELLY: Will the Under-Secretary say whether women and children have been engaged on this work during the last year?

Mr. ORMSBY-GORE: I have had no case in the last year.

ACTING GOVERNOR (UNOFFICIAL CONFERENCE).

Colonel WEDGWOOD asked the Secretary of State for the Colonies. whether his attention has been drawn to the fact that during a recent unofficial conference of Kenya settlers, at which resolutions were moved of a controversial nature, the Acting Governor attended and addressed this conference; and whether he is prepared to intimate to the Kenya Government the undesirability of prominent officials being associated with conferences called to discuss matters of such controversial character ?

Mr. ORMSBY-GORE: I presume that the right hon. and gallant Member refers to the East African unofficial conference which recently met at Nairobi. I know of no official association with the conference beyond the fact that the formal opening ceremony was performed by the Acting Governor of Kenya, a course which follows the precedent of the conference at Livingstone and to which I see no objection.

Colonel WEDGWOOD: In that case, will the Governor also open the Indian Congress to be held in East Africa?

Mr. ORMSBY-GORE: I must have notice of that question.

NATIVE RESERVES.

Sir R. HAMILTON asked the Secretary of State for the Colonies if any steps have been taken to clear up the conflict of opinion with regard to the rights of natives occupying lands within native reserves in Kenya, as disclosed in the case of Douglas Morangi; and whether any action has been taken with a view to resettling the people dispossessed under the judgment in the above case?

Mr. ORMSBY-GORE: I have not yet received any information from the Colonial Government with regard to the case referred to, but I assume that it will be dealt with in the Report which I am now awaiting with regard to the question of individual tenure.

Sir R. HAMILTON: Is the hon. Gentleman aware that this question was first put as long ago as May last?

Mr. ORMSBY-GORE: Yes, but as my hon. Friend knows, the subject is a very complex one. We did discuss this matter with the Governor

when he was on leave, and I expect a Report very soon.

Sir R. HAMILTON: Is any special action being taken with regard to

the dispossession by judgment in this case?

Mr. ORMSBY-GORE: I will make urgent inquiries.

(LABOUR, IMPORTATION).

Mr. AMMON asked the Under-Secretary of State for the Colonies whether, as an assurance was given that the conditions under which labour could be

imported into Kenya Colony would be laid before the House, he will say whether such conditions have yet been received from the Government of the Kenya Colony; and, if so, when it is expected that they will be laid before the House?

Mr. ORMSBY-GORE: I presume that the hon. Member refers to the supplementary reply given to the right hon. Member for Derby on the 8th February, 1926. It does not quite bear the construction he has put on it, but, as the Governor announced in the Legislative Council on the 10th August, 1926, that the Colonial Government is unfavourable to the importation of contract labour, the question no longer arises.

(LAND BANK).

24th November.

Mr. GILLETT asked the Under-Secretary of State for the Colonies whether the land bank, which has been approved by the Government of Kenya and which is to be financed out of the recent loan, is to be open to natives as well as to the white agriculturists?

Mr. ORMSBY-GORE: The proposals for a land bank in Kenya have not yet been formulated and the loan Ordinance does not authorise the financing of such a bank out of the recent loan. In the circumstances I have nothing to add to the answer which I gave to the hon. Member for East Edinburgh (Dr. Shiels) on the 24th February.

NATIVE LANDS (ALIENATION).

28th November.

Colonel WEDGWOOD asked the Under-Secretary of State for the Colonies whether, in view of the fact that the Kenya Government has not yet been able to submit proposals for the creation of a trustee board for native lands, he is prepared to intimate to the Kenya Government that no further alienations of land should take place to white settlers until proposals for the land trust for the natives have been approved by His Majesty's Government?

Mr. HERBERT WILLIAMS: Before that question is answered, may I ask whether it is in order to describe the inhabitants of this Colony as "natives," having regard to the protest made in this House when natives of India were so described?

Mr. SPEAKER: Apparently, susceptibilities differ in different continents.

Mr. ORMSBY-GORE: I do not know that in any part of Africa any African has ever objected to being called a native of the Continent. The areas over which the functions of the proposed boards would extend are not open to alienation to white settlers, and I therefore can see no reason to issue instruction as suggested. I might, however, add that the Governor's proposals for the formation of a native land trust have just been received.

Colonel WEDGWOOD: Is the right hon. Gentleman not aware that recently areas have been alienated from natives to whites and that there has been no final delimitation of the areas of the present native reserves ? Mr. ORMSBY-GORE: I think the right hon. Gentleman is wrong. My impression is that practically all boundaries of the native reserve have now been gazetted.

Colonel WEDGWOOD: Does "gazetted" mean final definition?

Mr. ORMSBY-GORE: Yes, final definition. The land within these native reserves will be inalienable, and will not be available for permanent settlement by other than natives of the particular reserve.

ORDINANCES (PUBLICATION).

Lieut.-Commander KENWORTHY asked the Under-Secretary of State for the Colonies whether he is yet in a position to state the result of his discussion with the Governor of Kenya Colony upon the advisability of publishing ordinances not only in English but in a language that the natives are capable of understanding?

Mr. ORMSBY-GORE: I have just received a dispatch from the Governor in which he reports that this question has recently been considered and that general notification of enactments particularly affecting natives can best be effected by district officers explaining at barazas in the local vernaculars the principal provisions of such enactments and by recording similarly in writing such main principles for the benefit and guidance of local native councils It is hoped in course of time to provide native councillors and the chief headman with summaries in the vernacular of the chief ordinances affecting natives, and directions to this end have already been given.

INDIANS (POLL-TAX FOR EDUCATION).

Mr. SNELL asked the Under-Secretary of State for the Colonies whether the Asiatic poll-tax is still in force against Indians in Kenya; and whether any proposals are under consideration for alternative taxes and what is the nature of these proposals ?

Mr. ORMSBY-GORE: I assume that the hon. Member refers to the special poll-tax for education, and not to the ordinary non-native poll-tax. The answer to the first part of the question is in the affirmative. The Government of Kenya have, however, invited the Indian members of the Legislative Council to suggest an alternative to this tax, and the Acting Governor reported that they were considering the matter with the assistance of the Treasurer and the Director of Education. I have not yet learnt whether any alternative has yet been put forward.

LEGISLATURE (NATIVE AFFAIRS).

Mr. JAMES HUDSON asked the Under-Secretary of State for the Colonies whether the statement by the Governor of Kenya Colony at the