is irregular in his appointment) sooner than leave it to be said, that this bill passed without it. The house being vociferous, he said, I am afraid I tire the house with my weak voice; if that is the case, I will not proceed, but I do think, and it is my sincere opinion, that we are the aggressors and innovators, and not the colonies. We have irritated and forced laws upon them for these six or seven years last past. We have enacted such a variety of laws, with these new taxes, together with a refusal to repeal the trifling duty on tea; all these things have served no other purpose but to distress and perplex. I think the Americans have done no more than every subject would do in an arbitrary state, where laws are imposed against their will. In my conscience, I think, taxation and legislation are in this case inconsistent. Have you not a legislative right over Ireland? And yet no one will dare to say we have a right to tax. These acts respecting America, will involve this country and its ministers in misfortunes, and I wish I may not add, in ruin.

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bearing has our conduct been, that it is incumbent upon us now to take a different course. Whatever may be the consequence, we must risk something; if we do not, all is over. The measure now proposed, is nothing more than taking the election of counsellors out of the hands of those people, who are continually acting in defiance and resistance of your laws. It has also been said by gentlemen-send for the Americans to your bar-give them redress a twelve-month hence. Surely, sir, this cannot be the language that is to give effectual relief to America; it is not, I say again, political convenience, it is political necessity that urges this measure; if this is not the proper method, show me any other which is preferable, and I will postpone it.

Sir George Young. It remains to me, sir, that it is unanswered and unanswerable, what has been advanced by the honorable gentleman who spoke second, that the parties should be heard, though even at a twelve-month hence. Nothing, sir, but fatal necessity can countenance this measure. No body of men ought to be proceeded against without being heard, much less ought the regulation of a whole government to take place, without the parties attending in their defence against such alterations.

Governor Johnston. I see, sir, a great disposition in this house to proceed in this business without knowing any thing of the consti

Lord North. I do not consider this matter of regulation to be taking away their charters in such manner as is represented; it is a regulation of government to assist the crown; it appears to me not to be a matter of political expediency, but of necessity. If it does not stand upon that ground, it stands on nothing. The account which has just now been read to you is an authentic paper, transmitted to gov-tution of America; several inconveniences will ernment here, showing that the council refused arise if the sheriff is to be appointed by the govin every case their assistance and advice; and ernor; the jury will, of course, be biased by some will this country sit still when they see the influence or other; special juries will be most colony proceeding against your own subjects, liable to this. [Here the governor gave an actarring and feathering your servants, denying count of the different riots which had happened your laws and authority, refusing every direc-in England, and compared them with what he tion and advice which you send? Are we, sir, called the false accounts of those from Amerseeing all this, to be silent, and give the gover-ica.] I impute, says he, all the misfortunes nor no support? Gentlemen say, let the colony come to your bar, and be heard in their defence; though it is not likely that they will come, when they deny your authority in every instance. Can we remain in this situation long? We must effectually take some measures to correct and amend the defects of that government. I have heard so many different opinions in regard to our conduct in America, I hardly know how to answer them. The honorable gentleman, who spoke last, formerly blamed the tame and insipid conduct of government; now he condemns this measure as harsh and severe. The Americans have tarred and feathered your subjects, plundered your merchants, burnt your ships, denied all obedience to your laws and authority; yet so clement and for

which have happened in America, to the taking away the power of the governor. No man of common sense can apprehend that the governor would ever have gone two or three days into the country, during these disturbances, if he had the command of the military power. The natural spirit of man would be fired, in such a manner, as to actuate himself to shew resistance; but in this governor no power was lodged. I disapprove much of the measure which is before us, and I cannot but think its consequences will be prejudicial.

Mr. C. Jenkinson. I rise, sir, only to observe, that if the colony has not that power within itself to maintain its own peace and order, the legislature should, and ought to have. Let me ask, sir, whether the colony took any step, in

any shape, to quell the riots and disturbances? | shall ask the council for advice, but it does not No, they took none. Let me ask again, whether say he shall not act without it, if they refuse to all the checks and control that are necessary, give it. It is said it is criminal to do any are not put into the commission of the govern- thing without advice of the council; I differ ments? Much has been said about hearing greatly, sir, from that doctrine; for I myself the parties, and taking away their chartered have acted without it in putting an end to disrights; I am of opinion, that where the right is turbances, in preserving the peace and good a high political regulation, you are not in that order of the place; if I had been governor durinstance bound to hear them; but the hearing ing the late disturbances, I would have given of parties is necessary where private property is an order for the military power to attend, and concerned. It is not only in the late proceed- then let me have seen what officer dare disobey. ings, but in all former, that they have denied I think the council are much to blame for not your authority over them; they have refused co-operating and assisting the governor, but I protection to his majesty's subjects, and in think the governor might have acted without every instance disobeyed the laws of this coun- the council. The council are inexcusable, try; either let this country forsake its trade with though not criminal, as they are not obliged to America, or let us give that due protection to give it. I, sir, for my part, shall give my last it which safety requires. opinion. I have always been in one way of thinking with regard to America, which I have both given here and wrote to America. They have all along tended to one point; but it is now no longer matter of opinion. Things are now come to action; and I must be free to tell the house, that the Americans will resist these measures: they are prepared to do it. I do not mean by arms, but by the conversation of public town meeting; they now send their letters by couriers, instead of the post, from one town to another; and I can say your post office will very soon be deprived of its revenue. With

Mr. Harris. I cannot see, sir, any reason for so wide a separation between America and England as other gentlemen are apt to think there ought to be; that country, sir, was hatched from this, and I hope we shall always keep it under the shadow of our wings. It has been said, no representation, no taxation. This was the system formerly adopted, but I do not find it authorized in any book of jurisprudence, nor do I deem it to be a doctrine either rea- | sonable or constitutional. I insist upon it, they are bound to obey both the crown and parliament. The last twelve years of our proceed-regard to the officers who command the militia ings have been a scene of lenity and inactivity. Let us proceed and mend our method, or else I shall believe, as an honorable gentleman has observed, that we are the aggressors.

Sir Edward Astley. If we have had a twelve years lenity and inactivity, I hope we shall not now proceed to have a twelve years cruelty and oppression. By the resolution and firmness which I perceive in the house, it seems to indicate a perseverance in the measure now proposed, which I deem to be a harsh one, and unworthy of a British legislature.

Mr. Ward. [The house was very noisy during the few words which he said.]-He found fault with the charter being left too much, as to the execution of its power, in the people, and he could not think the legislature was doing any thing, which it had not a right to do, as he had looked upon all charters to be granted with a particular clause in it expressing that it should not be taken away but by the parlia

ment.

Governor Pownal. I beg leave to set some gentlemen right, who have erred with regard to the charters of America. The appointment of several of the officers is in the governor. The charter of Boston directs, that the governor

of that country, they will have them of their own appointment, and not from government; but I will never more give an opinion concerning America in this house; those I have given have been disregarded.

Mr. Rigby. Upon my word, sir, what was just now said, is very worthy the consideration of this house; and if, from what the honorable gentleman says, it is true, and I believe he is well informed, it appears, that America is preparing to arms; and that the deliberations of their town meetings tend chiefly to oppose the measures of this country by force. He has told you, sir, that the Americans will appoint other officers than those sent by government to command their troops. He has told you that the post office is established on their account from town to town, in order to carry their traitorous correspondence from one to another. He has told you the post office revenue will soon be annihilated. If these things are true, sir, I find we have been the aggressors, by continually doing acts of lenity for these twelve years last past. I think, sir, and I speak out boldly when I say it, that this country has a right to tax America; but, sir, it is matter of astonishment to me, how an

honorable gentleman (Mr. Conway) can be the | duty; so, I find taxes are to be the reward of author of bringing in of declaratory law over obedience; and the Americans, who are conall America, and yet saying at one and the sidered to have been in open rebellion, are to same time, that we have no right to tax be rewarded by acquiescing in their measures. America? If I was to begin to say that When will be the time when America ought to America ought not to be taxed, and that these have heavy taxes laid upon it? The honorable measures were not proper, I would first desire gentleman (Mr. Rigby) tells you, that that my own declaratory law to be repealed; but time will be when the Americans are returned being of opinion that the Americans are the to peace and quietness. The honorable gentlesubjects of this country, I will declare freely, man tells us also, that we have a right to tax that I think this country has a right to tax Ireland; however I may agree with him in reAmerica; but I do not say that I would put gard to the principle, it would not be policy to any new tax on at this particular crisis; but exercise it; I believe we have no more right to when things are returned to a peaceable state, tax the one than the other. I believe America I would then begin to exercise it. And I am is wrong in resisting against this country, with free to declare my opinion, that I think we regard to legislative authority. It was an old have a right to tax Ireland, if there was a neces- opinion, and I believe a very true one, that sity so to do, in order to help the mother coun- there was a dispensing power in the crown, try. If Ireland was to rebel and resist our but whenever that dispensing power was prelaws, I would tax it. The mother country has tended to be exercised, it was always rejected an undoubted right and control over the whole and opposed to the utmost, because it operated of its colonies. Again, sir, a great deal has to me, as a subject, as a deteriment to my probeen said concerning requisition. Pray, in perty and liberty; but, sir, there has been a what manner is it to be obtained? Is the constant conduct practised in this country, king to demand it, or are we, the legislative consisting of violence and weakness; I wish power of this country, to send a very civil polite those measures may not continue; nor can I gentleman over to treat with their assemblies? think that the stamp-act would have been subHow and in what manner is he to address that mitted to without resistance, if the administraassembly? Is he to tell the speaker that we tion had not been changed; the present bill behave been extremely ill used by our neighbors fore you is not tanti to what you want; it irrithe French; that they have attacked us in tates the minds of the people, but does not several quarters; that the finances of this correct the deficiencies of that government. country are in a bad state; and therefore we desire you will be kind enough to assist us, and give us some money? Is this to be the language of this country to that; and are we thus to go cap in hand? I am of opinion, that if the adminstration of this country had not been changed soon after passing the stamp-act, that tax would have been collected with as much ease as the land-tax is in Great Britain. I have acted, with regard to America, one consistent part, and shall continue in it, till I hear better reasons to convince me to the contrary. Governor Pownal, (to explain) I apprehend I have been totally misunderstood. I did not assert the Americans were now in rebellion, but that they are going to rebel; when that comes to pass, the question will be, who was the occasion of it? Something has been said relative to requisition; I think I gave several instances wherein the same had been complied with in time of war.

Mr. C. Fox. I am glad to hear from the honorable gentleman who spoke last, that now is not the time to tax America; that the only time for that is, when all these disturbances are quelled, and they are returned to their

Sir Gilbert Elliot arose to answer Mr. C. Fox, which he did in a very masterly manner, by stating that there was not the least degree of absurdity in taxing your own subjects, over whom you have declared you had an absolute right; though that tax should, through necessity, be enacted at a time when peace and quietness were the reigning system of the times; you declare you have that right, where is the absurdity in the exercise of it?

Sir Richard Sutton read a copy of a letter, relative to the government of America, from a governor in America, to the board of trade, shewing that, at the most quiet times, the dispositions to oppose the laws of this country were strongly ingrafted in them, and that all their actions conveyed a spirit and wish for independence. If you ask an American who is his master? he will tell you he has none, nor any governor but Jesus Christ. I do believe it, and it is my firm opinion, that the opposition to the measures of the legislature of this country, is a determined prepossession of the idea of total independence.

After which the bill was committed for Friday next, without a division.

dominions, to make you conceive what misery this right of taxation is capable of producing in a provincial government. We need only recollect that our countrymen in India have, in the space of five or six years, in virtue of this CHAR-right, destroyed, and driven away more inhabit

It is of such great importance to compose, or even to moderate, the dissensions which subsist at present between our unhappy country and her colonies, that I cannot help endeavoring, from the faint prospect I have of contrib-geration, my lords, but plain matter of fact, uting something to so good an end, to overcome the inexpressible reluctance I feel at uttering my thoughts before the most respectable of all audiences.

utter strangers even to the name of whig and tory. In all changes, in all revolutions, they have quietly followed the fortunes and submitted to the government of England.

Now let me appeal to your lordships as to men of enlarged and liberal minds, who have

right was neither disputed, nor even considered. I have excited no opposition, they have been And let us not forget that the people of NewEngland were themselves, during the last war, the most forward of all in the national cause; that every year we voted them a considerable sum, in acknowledgment of their zeal and their services; that, in the preceding war, they alone enabled us to make the treaty of Aix-la-been led by your office and rank to the study of Chapelle, by furnishing us with the only equivalent for the towns that were taken from our allies in Flanders; and that, in times of peace, they alone have taken from us six times as much of our woolen manufactures as the whole kingdom of Ireland. Such a colony, my lords, not only from the justice, but from the gratitude we owe them, have a right to be heard in their defence; and if their crimes are not of the most inexpiable kind, 1 could almost say, they have a right to be forgiven.

history. Can you find in the long succession of ages, in the whole extent of human affairs, a single instance where distant provinces have been preserved in so flourishing a state, and kept at the same time in such due subjection to their mother-country? My lords, there is no instance; the case never existed before. It is perhaps the most singular phenomenon in all civil history; and the cause of it well deserves your serious consideration. The true cause is, that a mother-country never existed But in the times we speak of, our public in- before, who placed her natives and her colotercourse was carried on with ease and satis-nies on the same equal footing; and joined faction. We regarded them as our friends with them in fairly carrying on one common and fellow-citizens, and relied as much upon interest. their fidelity as on the inhabitants of our own country. They saw our power with pleasure for they considered it only as their protection. They inherited our laws, our language, and our customs; they preferred our manufactures, and followed our fashions with a partiality that secured our exclusive trade with them more effectually than all the regulations and vigilance of the custom-house. Had we suffered them to enrich us a little longer, and to grow a little richer themselves, their men of fortune, like the West-Indians, would undoubtedly have made this country the place of their education and resort. For they looked up to England with reverence and affection, as to the country of their friends and ancestors. They esteemed and they called it their home, and thought of it as the Jews once thought of the land of Canaan.

You ought to consider this, my lords, not as a mere historical fact, but as a most important and invaluable discovery. It enlarges our ideas of the power and energy of good government beyond all former examples; and shews that it can act like gravitation at the greatest distances. It proves to a demonstration that you may have good subjects in the remotest corner of the earth, if you will but treat them with kindness and equity. If you have any doubts of the truth of this kind of reasoning, the experience we have had of a different kind will entirely remove them.

The good genius of our country had led us to the simple and happy method of governing freemen, which I have endeavored to describe. Our ministers received it from their predecessors and for some time continued to observe it; but without knowing its value. At length, presuming on their own wisdom, and the quiet dispositions of the Americans, they flattered themselves that we might reap great advantages from their prosperity by destroying the cause of it. They chose, in an unlucky hour, to treat them as other nations have thought fit to treat their colonies; they threatened, and they taxed them.

Now, my lords, consider with yourselves what were the chains and ties that united this people to their mother-country with so much warmth and affection, at so amazing a distance. The colonies of other nations have been discontented with their treatment, and not without sufficient cause; always murmuring at their grievances, and sometimes breaking out into acts of rebellion. Our subjects at home, I do not now enquire whether taxation is with all their reasons for satisfaction, matter of right; I only consider it as matter of have never been entirely satisfied. Since the experiment; for surely the art of government beginning of this century we have had two itself is founded on experience. I need not rebellions, several plots and conspiracies; and suggest what were the consequences of this we ourselves been witnesses to the most dan- change of measures. The evils produced by gerous excesses of sedition. But the provinces it were such as we still remember and still in North America have engaged in no party, I feel. We suffered more by our loss of trade