Mr. DAVIS. A cash book.

The CHAIRMAN. And a ledger?

Mr. DAVIS. Yes.

The CHAIRMAN. Or journal, which?

Mr. DAVIS. Journal.

The CHAIRMAN. Did you have any correspondence with Mr. West in regard to these contributions!

Mr. DAVIS. No, none.

The CHAIRMAN. How did you get in contact with Mr. West? Mr. DAVIS. May I say that those contributions had nothing to do with the senatorial fight!

The CHAIRMAN. Oh, no: everybody tells us that. I want to judge that for myself.

Mr. Davis. We took no part in the senatorial fight itself.

The CHAIRMAN. Yes?

Mr. DAVIS. Made no recommendations, have not written a letter with any Senator's name in it.

The CHAIRMAN. Yes!

Mr. DAVIS. Issued no advice in behalf of any Senator. Simply a local organization dealing on a nonpartisan basis with a local situation. As an organization we were not interested in the senatorial campaign in any way whatsoever.

The CHAIRMAN. You act, however, first or last, in behalf of some

candidate?

Mr. DAVIS. No, sir.

The CHAIRMAN. You do not?

Mr. DAVIS. Not in favor of any senatorial candidate.

The CHAIRMAN. But some candidate for some office?

Mr. DAVIS. Oh, for local offices; yes, sir.

The CHAIRMAN. And that candidate is acting in alliance or concert with certain other candidates?

Mr. DAVIS. We do not take that into consideration at all.

The CHAIRMAN. I say that is a fact, is it not?

Mr. DAVIS. I presume it is; I presume they have some political

connection.

The CHAIRMAN. And in some places a whole group of candidates from Senator down

Mr. DAVIS. That is locally true, but we are not interested in that. The CHAIRMAN. I know you may not be, but I might be.

Mr. DAVIS. That is, our organization is not interested. We are a nonpartisan organization.

The CHAIRMAN. Will you tell me why the secretary of the Republican National Committee would contribute money to an organization that is purely local in its character and has nothing whatever to do with national matters?

Mr. DAVIS. He was the head of the local organization.

The CHAIRMAN. What local organization?

Mr. DAVIS. The county Republican organization. I believe he is secretary of the Republican county central committee; or at least of that faction. He is the head of the Deneen faction here.

The CHAIRMAN. Was he secretary of the Deneen county committee? Mr. DAVIS. I believe so.

The CHAIRMAN. And the chairman of the Deneen committee was giving money to your organization?

Mr. DAVIS. Yes, sir.

The CHAIRMAN. To be used against this ticket?

Mr. DAVIS. Against this ticket?

The CHAIRMAN. Yes.

Mr. DAVIS. It was for the-it was to help me-we indorse certain men and it happened to be that the most of them were

The CHAIRMAN. And you were not getting paid for the indorsement, were you?

Mr. DAVIS. We were getting paid for nothing; no, sir.

The CHAIRMAN. You were getting this money for some purpose, were you not?

Mr. DAVIS. We were particularly interested in one of the candidates he was interested in. That was the county judge. He indorsed the county judge. All indorsements were made before any contributions of any kind had been solicited.

The CHAIRMAN. And then the indorsement having been made, you go to the

Mr. DAVIS. No.

The CHAIRMAN. Political organization that is interested in the election of that man and get the money. Is that the idea?

Mr. DAVIS. In that case it was true.

The CHAIRMAN. You were only interested in one man, and Roy O. West gave you $4,000 for being interested in that one man.

Mr. DAVIS. He gave it. Our constituency in the primary was very largely with that group, the Republican-or with the Republican groups and part of this was in the interest of registration, which came about a month after the first contributions.

The CHAIRMAN. You were going to get your people out and registered?

Mr. DAVIS. Get them registered.

The CHAIRMAN. Is not your institution nonpartisan?

Mr. DAVIS. Absolutely.

The CHAIRMAN. But you were all interested in the Republican candidate and got your money from the secretary of the Republican National Committee?

Mr. DAVIS. We will indorse about an equal number of Democrats and Republicans for this election this fall."

The CHAIRMAN. But you were getting money from West with the understanding that it was going to be used to help elect Democrats? Mr. DAVIS. It was used in the primaries; that money was used in the primaries.

The CHAIRMAN. And most of your people belong to the Deneen faction?

Mr. DAVIS. He understands perfectly that we are a nonpartisan organization.

The CHAIRMAN. Just what did you do to earn this $4,000 that you got from Deneen and $2,500 you got from McKinley if you were not going to do anything for McKinley?

Mr. DAVIS. We did what we could to get as large a registration as possible.

The CHAIRMAN. For the benefit of McKinley?

Mr. DAVIS. We did not mention McKinley's name.

McKinley

may have felt-I presume he did-that if these Republicans registered he would get his share of constituency.

The CHAIRMAN. Your constituency?

Mr. DAVIS. Yes.

The CHAIRMAN. Frankly, when McKinley put up that $2,500 he expected you to deliver something, did he not?

Mr. DAVIS. No. Frankly, he expected no more than I told you; just the same and no more. We told him frankly that we would do nothing for him in the primary as in contradistinction to anybody else. That was told to him before he contributed a dollar.

The CHAIRMAN. So he gave up $2,500 to help himself and help his opponent equally?

Mr. DAVIS. If he felt that our constituency would be more likely to vote for him than others, it was only for that reason.

The CHAIRMAN. He understood that, did he?

Mr. DAVIS. Senator, there was no assurance given to him, whatsoever, not a word.

The CHAIRMAN. I know, but sometimes

Mr. DAVIS. No intimation of any kind.

The CHAIRMAN. Sometimes

Mr. DAVIS. None whatever.

The CHAIRMAN. We understand things

Mr. DAVIS. Just a moment, I say there was no intimation of any kind made other than what I have told you.

The CHAIRMAN. Who talked with McKinley to get this $2,500?

Mr. DAVIS. I talked to him first.

The CHAIRMAN. What did you say to him to get him to "loosen up" to the extent of $2,500?

Mr. DAVIS. I wish you would repeat that question, Senator.

The CHAIRMAN. I say, what did you say to him to get him to give you this $2,500?

Mr. DAVIS. I told him that I thought he would be interested in the work that we were doing.

The CHAIRMAN. Nothing was said about what you were going to do, was there?

Mr. DAVIS. There was not one promise made to him of any kind. The CHAIRMAN. But you were going to work in the campaign. Were you not going to try to get out the registration?

Mr. DAVIS. Certainly, certainly, to get just as large a registration as possible.

The CHAIRMAN. Did you go to Smith for any money?

Mr. DAVIS. No, sir.

The CHAIRMAN. Do you not think that McKinley understood that by giving this $2,500 he would get aid and assistance? Do you not think he understood that?

Mr. DAVIS. He did not.

The CHAIRMAN. It is the most reckless use of money in a campaign I ever heard of! I think that is all. We would like to get the total from these books.

Mr. DAVIS. I will bring the totals to you, get them certified and send them to you.

The CHAIRMAN. That is all right; just send it to me with your statement that it is the correct total; that is all I ask.

Mr. DAVIS. You shall have it.

The CHAIRMAN. Your word is perfectly good with me.

TESTIMONY OF CHESTER A. WILLOUGHBY-Resumed

(The witness was sworn by the chairman.)

The CHAIRMAN. Mr. Willoughby, you have been examined before? Mr. WILLOUGHBY. Yes, indeed.

The CHAIRMAN. And I believe you stated you had been the secretary of Senator McKinley?

Mr. WILLOUGHBY. Yes, sir.

The CHAIRMAN. You still hold that position?

Mr. WILLOUGHBY. Yes, sir.

The CHAIRMAN. Is Senator McKinley in such condition of health that he could give his testimony?

Mr. WILLOUGHBY. No, he is not. He is bed fast.

The CHAIRMAN. And he has been in that condition since this committee began its deliberations some months ago?

Mr. WILLOUGHBY. Three months ago, yes, sir.

The CHAIRMAN. Mr. Willoughby, do you know of a speech made by Senator Caraway in the United States Senate on June 26, 1926? Mr. WILLOUGHBY. Yes, sir. I read the speech.

The CHAIRMAN. Before or after it was delivered?

Mr. WILLOUGHBY. After it was delivered. I read it in the Congressional Record.

The CHAIRMAN. What did you have to do with the preparation of the material that went into that speech?

Mr. WILLOUGHBY. Nothing whatsoever, sir.

The CHAIRMAN. Is it a fact, or not a fact, that you prepared substantially all of the charges that are in this speech, and furnished them to Mr. Caraway?

Mr. WILLOUGHBY. It is not a fact.

The CHAIRMAN. Did you have any conference with Mr. Caraway, before he made his speech, touching any of the matters that are mentioned in his speech?

Mr. WILLOUGHBY. No, indeed.

The CHAIRMAN. Do you know where Mr. Caraway obtained the information?

Mr. WILLOUGHBY. I do not; no, sir.

The CHAIRMAN. Have you any information touching the question as to where Mr. Caraway obtained any parts of the information which he afterwards produced in his speech?

Mr. WILLOUGHBY. I have not; no, sir.

The CHAIRMAN. Did you have a conference with some newspaper men-man or men-before Mr. Caraway made this speech, touching the substance of any of the charges contained in this speech?

Mr. WILLOUGHBY. I am at the Press Club. I might have talked to different men, but not about that speech; because I did not know anything about it until after it had been delivered.

The CHAIRMAN. At the Press Club, or at any other place, did you make statements touching the matters that Mr. Caraway afterwards referred to?

Mr. WILLOUGHBY. I do not recall; no, sir.

The CHAIRMAN. Did you make any memoranda in writing containing the substance of any of these charges which Mr. Caraway afterwards put forth on the floor of the United States Senate? Mr. WILLOUGHBY. I do not recall any; no, sir.

The CHAIRMAN. Did you have in your possession any such memoranda?

Mr. WILLOUGHBY. I do not recall them.

The CHAIRMAN. Did you show such a memorandum to any United States Senator except Mr. Caraway?

Mr. WILLOUGHBY. I did not show any to Mr. Caraway.

The CHAIRMAN. I am leaving him out.

Mr. WILLOUGHBY. Nor anyone else; no, sir.

The CHAIRMAN. You did not show it to any United States Senator?

Mr. WILLOUGHBY. No, sir.

The CHAIRMAN. You know nothing about where the material Senator Caraway employed in his speech came from?

Mr. WILLOUGHBY. I do not; no, sir.

The CHAIRMAN. I will say now-I am not asking this to reflect on Senator Caraway or you that if you were the author of any part of this speech, I wanted to ask you some questions touchingMr. WILLOUGHBY. If I have what, please?

The CHAIRMAN. If you were the author of any statements in this speech-not of the speech itself-I wanted to ask you some questions in regard to some matters that have not been disclosed.

Mr. WILLOUGHBY. Well, I am not, sir.

The CHAIRMAN. You know nothing about it?

Mr. WILLOUGHBY. No, sir. I might say that right after the campaign I went to California and was out there about six weeks and did not return to Washington until probably the latter part of May-maybe the early part of June.

The CHAIRMAN. That would be time enough for June 26.
Mr. WILLOUGHBY. I thought that was made prior to that.

The CHAIRMAN. Did you ever have any talk about a man named Dan Schuyley-his collecting money for use in the colored wards and foreign-language groups of Chicago?

Mr. WILLOUGHBY. I do not remember any conversation. It was just general talk that somebody had collected money for the southern wards, but I did not know who it was.

The CHAIRMAN. You did not refer to Schuyler?

Mr. WILLOUGHBY. I do not recall that I did.

The CHAIRMAN. Had you heard that he was connected with it? Mr. WILLOUGHBY. Just as the attorney representing Mr. Insull,

I think.

The CHAIRMAN. You heard that he was attorney for Insull, engaged in this?

Mr. WILLOUGHBY. Just connected, yes.

The CHAIRMAN. You can not give us the names of the persons who gave you this information?

Mr. WILLOUGHBY. Oh, no. It was just political gossip around the headquarters.

The CHAIRMAN. There is a statement here in this speech: "It is charged that Governor Small's tax commission functioned very efficiently in the recent primary." Did you make any such statement

as that?

Mr. WILLOUGHBY. I did not.

The CHAIRMAN. Do you know anything about that?
Mr. WILLOUGHBY. I do not.