Mr. McCoy. I will.

(The Department of Commerce subsequently reported: A check showed that there was such a report and that it was marked "confidential." This was not a security classification but was intended to restrict the document to internal use only.)

Mr. WALDEN. May I ask you another question?

Mr. McCoy. Yes.

Mr. WALDEN. Do you find it common from your experience-you are a full-time Government employee, are you not?

Mr. McCoy. Yes, sir.

Mr. WALDEN. Do you find it common, Mr. McCoy, for WOC's to attempt to have your decisions overruled or to have pressure brought upon you by writing to their companies requesting them to write to you or do other activities?

Mr. McCoy. WOC's and I have disagreed frequently and still do about matters. I don't know of any occasions in which a WOC would see fit to take his argument with me to his company or to anyone else. Mr. WALDEN. You never encountered such an instance?

Mr. McCoy. I don't know about such an instance.

Mr. FINE. Perhaps except your superior.

Mr. McCoy. All these matters get before the Administrator, myself, the Assistant Secretary, and the Secretary in which everybody who has an opinion is heard. So surely they disagree in front of my superiors with me. They frequently have.

Mr. RODINO. He is free to consult with his friends or former employer or private employer as to his feelings, disagreements?

Mr. McCoy. A WOC is under no more restrictions than I am or any other employee of our organization to seek advice and suggestions from people in industry, from business. If he feels he should consult people.

Mr. WALDEN. Mr. Honeywell, instead of asking you a series of questions, may I ask you, is this a correct description of the present setup of BDSA?

Mr. McCoy is the Deputy Administrator; you are the Administrator. There are three Assistant Administrators who are WOC's. And Mr. White, who is the Assistant Deputy Administrator, is a fulltime employee. And there are 25 industry divisions in BDSA in which 10 are headed by full-time Government employees and 15 by WOC's.

Mr HONEYWELL. That is correct.

Mr. WALDEN. Mr. Chairman, may I put a chart in the record at this time showing the facts as I have just outlined them?

(The document referred to is herewith inserted :)

Mr. WALDEN. Is it fair to say that eventually you hope to have all these 23 divisions headed by WOC's?

Mr. HONEYWELL. No; that is not correct.

Mr. WALDEN. Did you or did you not state on February 4, 1954, before the Chicago conference on industry, which document has already been read from by the chairman:

Other key executives from industry serving without compensation for the Government are directors of most of the industry divisions. In time we hope to have all of these divisions headed by WOC's as we call them for serving without compensation.

Did you or did you not say that before that group?

Mr. HONEYWELL. I believe I probably said that. That was said at the time when I was in my position-this is February?

The CHAIRMAN. February 1954.

Mr. HONEYWELL. I had been in my position less than 6 months.
The CHAIRMAN. Have you changed your views since then?

Mr. HONEYWELL. I have changed my views to the extent that there are certain divisions with certain specicific responsibilities that are not primarily defense and mobilization, and for that reason we are making no effort to get WOC men to head those divisions.

The CHAIRMAN. What divisions are they?

Mr. HONEYWELL. They are largely the 10 which are presently headed by career men, but that is not a fixed 10. Let me specifically, as I glance at this chart, point out the Textile Division. There is very little work for the Textile Division at the present time in direct defense and mobilization work. It is largely a service organization.

The CHAIRMAN. And that is headed by a career man?

Mr. HONEYWELL. That is headed by a career man, Mr. Henry Thurston.

The CHAIRMAN. The tendency then is to get WOC's to head divisions directly concerned with mobilization?

Mr. HONEYWELL. That is correct.

The CHAIRMAN. Why is that?

Mr. HONEYWELL. In the first place that is where the WOC is authorized under the Defense Production Act.

The CHAIRMAN. And you don't have career men who are familiar with mobilization so they can occupy those positions?

Mr. HONEYWELL. We do not have men of the stature required to head those divisions. We have deputy directors in each of these divisions or in some cases the director is a career man in that case the WOC is the deputy.

Mr. ScoTT. As, for example, in the Scientific, Motion Picture and Photographic Products Division, you have the Director a full-time employee and the Deputy Director a WOC?

Mr. HONEYWELL. That is correct.

Mr. WALDEN. The assistant administrators, they are WOC's?
Mr. HONEYWELL. They are.

Mr. WALDEN. Is it a fair statement to say with respect to these assistant administrators that you would not appoint a full-time Government employee to those positions even if you could?

Mr. HONEYWELL. The organization chart is set up so they will be WOC's.

Mr. WALDEN. Even if a Government employee were available and he said he was pretty well qualified and wanted to be an assistant administrator?

Mr. HONEYWELL. Under our present organization chart it is not available to a full-time employee.

The CHAIRMAN. Isn't that a violation of the Executive order? You must search for a career man first and if he can fill the shoes you are under an obligation to fill that position with him?

Mr. HONEYWELL. I have said qualified men are not available.

Mr. WALDEN. Even if a qualified man were available, I said in my hypothetical question.

Mr. HONEYWELL. I missed that point. We have not located anyone who is interested whom we consider qualified to handle those positions. Mr. WALDEN. My statement was if you found a qualified man, and he said he wanted to be an assistant administrator your answer was that you would not allow him to be an assistant administrator because the organiztion chart did not allow that.

Mr. HONEYWELL. May I change my answer? I missed the question entirely.

Mr. WALDEN. I would like to introduce here into the record Executive Order 10182 and related orders thereto.

The CHAIRMAN. Yes.

(The documents referred to are as follows:)

[Immediate release, November 21, 1950]

EXECUTIVE ORDER 10182

PROVIDING FOR THE APPOINTMENT OF CERTAIN PERSONS UNDER THE DEFENSE PRODUCTION ACT OF 1950 AND PRESCRIBING REGULATIONS FOR THE EXEMPTION FROM CERTAIN CONFLICT-OF-INTEREST STATUTES

By virtue of the authority vested in me by the Defense Production Act of 1950, approved September 8, 1950 (Public Law 774, 81st Congress), hereinafter referred to as the Act, it is hereby ordered as follows:

PART I

Section 101. (a) The head of any department or agency delegated or assigned functions under the Act [pursuant to Executive Order No. 10161, of September 9, 1950] is hereby delegated the authority provided by subsection 710 (b) of that Act to employ persons of outstanding experience and ability without compensation. The authority delegated by this subsection 101 (a) may not be redelegated. (b) Such heads of departments or agencies are further delegated the authority provided by subsection 710 (c) of that Act to employ experts and consultants, or organizations thereof.

(c) Such heads of departments or agencies are further delegated the authority provided by subsection 710 (d) of that Act to utilize the services of Federal, State, and local agencies and to utilize and establish such regional, local, or other agencies, and to utilize such voluntary and uncompensated services as may from time to time be needed.

Section 102. The head of any department or agency delegated authority pursuant to subsections 101 (a) and 101 (b) of this Part shall be guided in the exercise of that authority by the following policies:

(a) So far as possible, operations under the Act shall be carried on by fulltime, salaried employees of the Government, and appointments under this authority shall be to advisory or consultative positions only.

(b) Appointments to positions other than advisory or consultative may be made under this order only when the requirements of the position are such that the incumbent must personally possess outstanding experience and ability not obtainable on a full-time, salaried basis.

(c) In the appointment of personnel and in assignment of their duties, the head of the department or agency involved shall take steps to avoid, to as great an extent as possible, any conflict between the governmental duties and the private interests of such personnel.

Section 103. The authority delegated by subsection 101 (c) to utilize at the regional and local levels voluntary and uncompensated services is not subject to the policies prescribed in section 102. Such authority may not be exercised, however, to fill positions subject to the Classification Act of 1949.

PART II

Section 201. Any person employed under Part I of this order is hereby exempted, with respect to such employment, from the operation of sections 281,

283, 284, 434, and 1914 of Title 18, United States Code, and section 190 of the Revised Statutes (5 U. S. C. 99), except as specified in the following subsections: (a) Exemption hereunder shall not extend to the negotiation or execution, by an appointee under this order, of Government countracts with the private employer of such appointee or with any corporation, joint stock company, association, firm, partnership, or other entity in the pecuniary profits or contracts of which the appointee has any direct or indirect interest.

(b) Exception hereunder shall not extend to making any recommendation or taking any action with respect to individual applications to the Government for relief or assistance, on appeal or otherwise, under the provisions of the Act made by the private employer of the appointee or by any corporation, joint stock company, association, firm, partnership, or other entity in the pecuniary profits or contracts of which the appointee has any direct or indirect interest. (c) In the case of appointments under subsections 101 (a) and 101 (b) hereof, exemption hereunder shall not extend to the prosecution by the appointee, or participation by the appointee in any fashion in the prosecution of any claims against the Government involving any matter concerning which the appointee had any responsibility during his employment under this order, during the period of such employment and the further period of two years after the termination of such employment. In the case of appointments under subsection 101 (c) hereof, exemption hereunder shall not extend to the prosecution by the appointee, or participation by the appointee in any fashion in the prosecution of any claims against the Government growing out of any matter with respect to which the appointee was personally concerned in his official capacity during his employment under this order, during the period of such employment and the further period of two years after the termination of such employment.

(d) In the case of appointments under subsections 101 (a) and 101 (b) hereof, exemption hereunder shall not extend to the receipt or payment of salary in connection with the appointee's Government service hereunder from any source other than the private employer of the appointee at the time of his appointment hereunder.

(e) Exemption from sections 434 and 1914 of Title 18, United States Code, shall not extend to persons appointed as experts or consultants under subsection 101 (b) hereof.

PART III

Section 301. Appointments under subsection 101 (a) of this order shall be supported by written certification by the head of the employing department or agency:

(a) That the appointment is necessary and appropriate in order to carry out the provisions of the Act;

(b) That the duties of the position to which the appointment is being made require outstanding experience and ability;

(c) That the appointee has the outstanding experience and ability required by the position; and

(d) That the department or agency head has been unable to obtain a person with the qualifications necessary for the position on a full-time, salaried basis. Section 302. The heads of the departments or agencies making appointments under this order shall file with the Division of the Federal Register (for public inspection but not for publication) a statement including the name of the appointee, the section of this order under which he was appointed, the employing department or agency, the title of his position, and the name of his private employer.

Section 303. All appointments under subsections 710 (b), 710 (c), and 710 (d) of the Act shall be made under the terms of this order after the date hereof, and appointments heretofore made under those subsections of the Act shall be deemed for all purposes to have been made under this order upon compliance with the preceding sections of this Part.

Section 304. At least once every three months, the Chairman of the United States Civil Service Commission shall survey appointments made under this order and shall report his findings to the President and make such recommendations as he may deem proper.

THE WHITE HOUSE, November 21, 1950.

HARRY S. TRUMAN.

[Immediate release, January 16, 1951]

EXECUTIVE ORDER 10205

AMENDING EXECUTIVE ORDER No. 10182 RELATING TO THE APPOINTMENT OF CERTAIN PERSONS UNDER THE DEFENSE PRODUCTION ACT OF 1950

By virtue of the authority vested in me by the Defense Production Act of 1950, approved September 8, 1950 (Public Law 774, 81st Congress), it is hereby ordered, effective November 21, 1950, as follows:

1. Subsection 101 (a) of Executive Order No. 10182 of November 21, 1950, is amended to read as follows:

"SEC. 101. (a) The head of any department or agency delegated or assigned functions under the Act is hereby delegated the authority provided by subsection 710 (b) of the Act to employ persons of outstanding experience and ability without compensation. Authority to employ persons under this subsection 101 (a) in any such department or agency shall not be redelegated by the head of such department or agency."

2. Subsection 201 (d) of the said Executive Order No. 10182 is amended to read as follows:

"(d) In the case of appointments under subsection 101 (a) hereof, exemption hereunder shall not extend to the receipt or payment of salary in connection with the appointee's Government service hereunder from any source other than the private employer of the appointee at the time of his appointment hereunder."

3. That part of section 301 of the said Executive Order No. 10182 which precedes paragraph (a) thereof is amended to read as follows:

"Section 301. Appointments under subsection 101 (a) of this order to positions other than advisory or consultative shall be supported by written certification by the head of the employing department or agency:"

THE WHITE HOUSE,

HARRY S. TRUMAN.

January 16, 1951.

[Immediate release, February 28, 1951]

EXECUTIVE ORDER

DEFINING CERTAIN RESPONSIBILITIES OF FEDERAL AGENCIES WITH RESPECT TO TRANSPORTATION AND STORAGE

By virtue of the authority vested in me by the Constitution and statutes, including the Defense Production Act of 1950, and as President of the United States and the Commander in Chief of the armed forces, and in order to assure the adequacy and effective utilization of transportation and storage facilities to meet the needs of national defense and of domestic and foreign commerce, it is hereby ordered as follows:

PART I. DOMESTIC TRANSPORTATION AND STORAGE

Section 101. The commissioner of the Interstate Commerce Commission who is responsible for the supervision of the Bureau of Service of the Commission shall in utilizing the functions vested in him under the Defense Production Act of 1950:

(a) Assemble and analyze data with respect to requirements to be imposed on domestic transportation and storage systems and facilities and with respect to the ability of such systems and facilities to satisfy such requirements.

(b) Formulate such plans and programs, and take such actions, as may be desirable to meet requirements for domestic transportation and storage, including, among other things, programs and measures for increasing the efficiency and obtaining maximum utilization of domestic transportation and storage systems and facilities and for providing additional transportation and storage facilities.

(c) Coordinate and direct the domestic movement of passenger and freight traffic in cooperation with the Interstate Commerce Commission and private transportation organization and agencies.

67271-55-pt. 1-30