and so deeply affecting the dignity and character of this House, are stated to them, will not fail to do their duty. If they do not, I will venture to say this is the first time when such a proceeding was passed over. If the hon. member should decline to proceed, some other hon. member will, I am sure, take the matter up. Sir G. Hill said, that as he had presented the petition in question, the House would naturally expect some explanation from him. All he could say was, that the petition was enclosed to him by Mr. Digby, a magistrate of the neighbourhood, who apprised him that it was most respectably signed. Mr. Digby and Mr. Waddy were both most respectable gentlemen, and it surprised him that the latter did not at once require from the former some explanation of the matter. It puzzled him altogether, and he knew not what to make of the business. He should not, of course, oppose any investigation. Mr. Hume said, he would make a motion upon the subject, if no other member gave notice of one. named. Those fees, he believed, were fixed on the calculation of the number of causes heard at the time of passing the act, and were intended to afford a reasonable recompence to the presiding officer; the causes had very greatly increased since that time, and consequently the recompence of the judge had increased in the same proportion. It was notorious that the place was one of great value. By returns which were laid before the House some years ago, it appeared that the amount of fees received in London only, was above 2,000l. a-year, but it was said that the payments which the judge had to make reduced his income to 1,500Z. He was anxious to obtain an accurate statement of the particulars, and the whole amount of those payments, and this was one of the objects he sought in the returns he should move for. He had no doubt it would be found that the judge had a nett income arising from the causes heard in London only, greatly exceeding 1,500l. a-year. The duty by which he earned that salary, was by sitting, as he had said, twice a-week in London to determine causes. By the return which he had just mentioned, it appeared that the number of causes which he had then to hear, amounted to about seventeen thousand a-year, which gave an average of one hundred and sixty causes to be disposed of every Court day. Admitting that many of those causes required little MIDDLESEX COUNTY COURT.] Mr. or no time for their decision, he thought Lennard said, he wished very shortly to it must still be obvious, that one day was state the grounds on which he asked for too little for the disposal of one hundred the returns which were the object of his and sixty causes. He thought it would present motion. The County Court of the be found, when he obtained his returns, County of Middlesex was established by that the number of causes had increased Act of Parliament, and had jurisdiction since the last returns were made, in which throughout the whole County of Middle-case it would be obvious, that the business sex in causes under 40s. The judge of of the court and that the profits of the that court, who was called the county judge had also increased. But supposing clerk, and must be a barrister of three they had only remained stationary, he years' standing, was appointed by the thought the House would feel that sheriff for the time being, and held his there was ground both for reducing the place for life. That officer, or his deputy, fees, and for calling on the court to apfor he was allowed to appoint a deputy, propriate more time to the performance of sat twice a week in London, for the its duties. It must be recollected that purpose of hearing causes, and two other the object of courts of that sort was to days in each month in other parts of render justice cheap and accessible to the Middlesex; that was to say, the first poorer orders: and it must be recollected, Tuesday in every month in one of the that it was out of their pockets that the hundreds of Isleworth and Elthorne, and fees were paid, so that any reduction in the last Tuesday in Edmonton. His the fees was a good in itself, and was salary arose from fees which he was calculated more completely to carry into entitled to under the act he had just leffect the objects contemplated by the Mr. Dawson said, that having been the person, who brought the matter forward, he should not shrink from prosecuting the inquiry, and would therefore move for a committee to inquire into the facts of the case. A committee was accordingly appointed. legislature when it established the court. course of seven years amounting to 1,400. He knew that the court had been praised In most of those courts there were some by Blackstone for the low rate of its fees; security for the due application of these but if, from the increase in the number of balances. In the court for the Tower causes heard, it might be possible still Hamlets, the treasurer gave security. In further to reduce the rate of those fees, the court of Southwark, it was the pracleaving the judge at the same time an tice that such balances should be vested adequate remuneration, he thought that in the funds in the names of trustees. an object which the House would not He believed there was no security of this deem unworthy of its consideration. If or any other sort in the court of the it should be thought that the judge had county of Middlesex.-It was another a vested interest in the present rate of fees, object he had in view in moving for these at least some prospective measure might returns, to ascertain what was the real be passed, to take effect when the interest state of the case in these respects. He of the present county clerk might have was aware that the right hon. Secretary terminated; but he should think the best was to bring the subject of county courts course to be pursued would be, one similar before the House, but he believed the to that recommended by the right hon. court of the county of Middlesex would gentleman opposite last year, in regard to not be comprised in his bill. When patent offices. He then said, it would be he had got the returns, he should enter advantageous to the public to purchase more at large into the question, and he those fees of the officers, to pay the officer thought he should be able to show that who received them fixed salaries, and carry some alteration was necessary. It was the surplus into the Treasury. So he possible, however, that the right hon. should think it advantageous to make gentleman might think the point worthy compensation to the officer of this court, of consideration in the framing of his bill, and to give him a fixed salary in future. and he should be most happy if he should But, whatever might be the opinion of the succeed in directing his attention to it. House upon that point, he thought one If the present court should continue in its thing at least was certain; namely, that actual state, when the bill of the right hon. if the amount of causes to be heard gentleman came into effect, there would annually were as great now as they were then be two county courts for the county of when the last returns were made, they Middlesex; the one having jurisdiction would be fully authorized in calling on over causes under 40s., the other over the county clerk to devote more time to causes under 101. It was obvious, that that the hearing of them.--Another point upon could not be intended, and he trusted that which he was desirous of obtaining inform- the right hon. gentleman, when this point ation was, as to the balances of money was brought under his consideration would remaining in court, and as to the security at the same time consider all the other there was for the due application of them. points connected with that court. He was It was the practice of the county court of sure the subject would be far better in the Middlesex, as of most other courts of hands of the right hon. gentleman than in Request, to admit payments of debts by his hands, and he should be rejoiced if instalments; and which were made into the right hon. gentleman should find reason court, in order to be repaid again to the under make inquiry into it. The hon. parties interested. It often happened, member concluded by moving for returns that the money so paid continued for a of the number of causes tried in the Midconsiderable time unclaimed; and, not dlesex county court since the appointment unfrequently, it was never claimed at of the present county clerk; of the gross all. The consequence was, that large amount of costs or fees paid by persons balances accumulated in these courts. suing or sued in the said court up to the From returns made in 1819, it appeared 25th March last; of the sums received by that, in the court of Requests for the the county clerk, his deputy, or other Tower Hamlets, a balance had accumu- officers of the court; together with an lated, in the course of nineteen years, to account of the amount of balances of unthe amount of 2,2001.; in the court of paid monies in hand; a statement of the Requests for Southwark to the amount manner in which those balances were of 2,300l. In the county court of Mid-applied, and whether any security was dlesex there had been a balance, in the given for the payment of them. The motion was agreed to. Lord METROPOLIS ROADS BILL.] Lowther, in moving for leave to bring in a bill to alter and amend the Metropolis Turnpike Act, north of the river Thames, observed, that three years ago a bill was brought in, to consolidate all the road trusts in the neighbourhood of London. That bill had merely put all the roads into one act, without making any material alteration in the customary regulations under which the trusts had been managed. If it had gone further, and relieved some of the outskirts of the town from the payment of tolls, perhaps it might have been better. At the time, however, there were eleven miles of streets upheld by turnpike trusts, which were now reduced to three miles. A considerable portion of debt, previously incurred, had also been reduced. He now came to the House with a proposition to alter and amend the act, under which the roads north of the metropolis were conducted. The bill would throw the new road in Gray's-inn-lane upon the parishes to keep it up. The same thing would be done in other cases of a similar nature. Objections might, perhaps, be taken to this, as imposing an unnecessary burthen. He did not think the burthen would be much. Originally it was thought that no turnpike rate ought to be considered high, unless it exceeded 6d. in the pound; now, the average of this rate would not exceed Id., or at the utmost 2d. Many of the outlets in the north of the metropolis had become actual towns, and were lighted and provided with all appurtenances as such. It was desirable that their streets should not be intersected as they were at present with turnpike bars. From the communications he had had with the parishes, he understood that no objection was likely to be raised to the proposition. They found that they could employ their paupers advantageously, in breaking stones &c., under the new arrangement, and thus diminish the parish rates. The noble lord concluded by moving for leave to bring in a bill to the effect stated. Mr. Maberly seconded the motion, and expressed his conviction that the measure, though apparently one of a local advantage, was calculated to benefit the whole of the metropolis. In the immediate neighbourhood of London, crowded as it was, we could hardly proceed a hun dred yards without being obstructed by turnpikes. Great advantage, it must be admitted, had arisen out of the measure for the consolidation of the metropolitan turnpike trusts; the results had been improved roads and diminished tolls. It was extremely desirable that the communication between the west end of the town and the city should be rendered as free from obstruction as possible. One of the objects of the bill was to remove all the gates from the Edgwareroad to the city, so as to open a free communication between the east and west of the metropolis. It was fair that parishes should maintain their own roads; and in this case the rate would not exceed a penny in the pound, on the average. He was sure that the measure would prove a great convenience to the public at large, who ought gratefully to acknowledge the benefit. Indeed, the public was already under great obligations to the noble lord. No commission could be better managed than that over which the noble lord presided; and when the present measure was accomplished, he was sure the public could not fail to see and acknowledge its practical effect. Leave was given to bring in the bill. AUCTION DUTIES.] The House having resolved itself into a committee on the Auction Duties' Acts, He The Chancellor of the Exchequer said, that in the present instance he had to propose a string of resolutions which were the result of the investigation which had been undertaken by himself and others into the mode of improving and regulating the collection of the Excise. had resolved to commence with this branch of it, because, as the duties stood at present, their payment was frequently evaded, and considerable suspicion might arise that it was not unfrequently accompanied by fraud. The first step to effect the improvement was the alteration of the duty from 51. per cent. on goods, chattels, interest, and estates sold as the law now stood, with exceptions in cases of property bought in, to an invariable duty of 11. per cent. on all property put up to sale and sold, though bought in by the owner. This would render the law intelligible to all, exempt sellers of property from all unnecessary oaths, and remove the temptation to, as well as the suspicion of, fraud in the collection and in the payment of these duties. The right hon. gentleman concluded by moving, that it was the opinion of the committee that the present duties of Excise, of five per cent on goods disposed of by auction, should hereafter cease and determine, and that in lieu thereof the following duties be imposed: namely, on every 1007., where the sale did not exceed 10,000l., 17. sterling; on every 1007., where it did exceed 10,000l., but not 20,000l., 17. on the first 10,000l., and 10s. for every additional 1001.; on every 1001. where the sale did exceed 20,000l., but did not exceed 40,000., 15s. for the first 20,000,, and 5s. on each additional 1007. on every 1007. where the sale amounted to 40,000l., and upwards, 10s. to the extent of 40,000l., and for every 1001. above that amount of sale, 1s.; and whenever a fractional part of 100%. should constitute part of the proceeds of the sale by auction, there should be taken a duty of 24d. in the 17. sterling. The resolutions were agreed to. HOUSE OF LORDS. Wednesday, April 1. ROMAN CATHOLIC CLAIMS-PETITIONS FOR AND AGAINST.] Lord Clifden said, he had a petition to present, and as it was of a peculiar nature, he would take the liberty of saying a few words respecting its contents. The petition was against that clause of the bill for the removal of the disabilities affecting our Roman Catholic fellow subjects, which gave to the government power over the Jesuits, and the other monastic institutions in Great Britain. It was signed by one of the best and most honest men in his majesty's dominions, than whom he believed there was not, either in the House or out of the House, a man who more ardently wished for the peace of Ireland, the security of this kingdom, and the general prosperity of the empire; he meant Dr. James Doyle, the Roman Catholic bishop of Kildare and Leighlin. He was sorry that such a clause was inserted, for it disfigured a bill, which was one of the most useful and beneficial bills which ever came before parliament. As he understood the clause, the great object of it was, to exclude the Jesuits from this country. That the Jesuits of old were in possession of vast power, all their lordships knew well they were the confessors of sovereigns, who were the weakest mortals that ever walked upon the earth-he meant the monarchs of the Austrian family, and also those of Spain. He believed that they were the confessors of Philip 2nd, of Philip 3rd, of Philip 5th, and of Charles 4th of Spain, who was little better than a drivelling idiot. The Jesuits, who were men of great talent and ability, were the confessors of these men. They educated men of high degree; they were the tutors of those who held high situations in the army and in the state, and thus they gained a degree of power over individuals, which enabled them afterwards to wield a still greater power over the monarch. At the same time that they lived in this manner with the great, they did not neglect the lower orders; but wherever they found a clever man amongst them, they rescued him from his obscurity, and made him a brother of their order. The Jesuits were also the confessors of that weak but courageous man, Louis 13th, and of his son and successor, Louis 14th, whose character had been displayed by St. Simon in its real colours. They were severely attacked by the other orders of the Church of Rome, in consequence of the power which they thus obtained; but what, he would ask, was the reason that they had ever had the means of acquiring such power? The ignorance of the different ages in which they lived. In that day there was no public press to expose their designs. The public press was the enemy of the society of the Jesuits. They had been protected and encouraged in France by Charles 10th, but notwithstanding such protection, the power of the press had beaten them down. Supposing the Jesuits were ever to gain a footing in the country, could they ever hope to withstand the attacks of "The Times," or of any other paper conducted with equal ability and success? It was impossible that they could. There were at present only two establishments of Jesuits in the United Kingdom-the one in Ireland, the other at Stonyhurst, in Lancashire. He under stood that all round the neighbourhood of those places the Jesuits were universally respected as good instructors of youth, and as charitable and humane members of society. He had no doubt that the noble duke at the head of the government, and those who were now joined with him in the administration of affairs, would use with great temper and moderation the power against these men, which was given them by this clause of the bill. He trusted that other governments would act in the same manner; but if they did not, he thought that the severity of the clause would defeat its own object. The first thing which any government must do to carry this clause into execution must be to catch the offender, then it must prove him to be a Jesuit, and lastly it must prove him to be doing something wrong; or else the press, which had been so long the enemy of the Jesuits, would raise in their defence such a clamour and clatter around the ears of ministers, as they could not long support in a free country. As he was convinced that this clause could never, in the present improved state of society, be productive of any ill effects, he should not think of opposing it. The Jesuits had been in existence as a body for upwards of three hundred years, and had gained most of their power within the first forty years after their incorporation. Europe was then in a state of half barbarism, and in such a state, beyond all others, knowledge must always command power. Consider what the condition of this country was, even during the reign of the two first Georges. It only began to improve just before the end of the AmeIn old magazines, we read of repeated instances of gentlemen amusing themselves by pinking holes in the bodies of persons they occasionally met in the streets. If any lord or gentleman were to betake himself to such amusement now, sir Richard Birnie and his myrmidons would presently teach him a lesson how to do bodily harm, and would leave him, in all probability, to the tender care of the finisher of the law. But, bad as men were then, they were far worse in the times of the crusades, when they appeared to have been as stupid and as ferocious as the beasts of the field. The consequence was, that the popes, the Bonifaces and the Innocents then acquired great power; and no wonder, for they either had themselves, or were able to employ, all the knowledge of their age. The power of the popes was afterwards transferred, in a great degree, to the Jesuits; and the same ignorance on the part of the monarch, which made the monarchs of the early ages the slaves of the papal power, made Louis 14th the slave of the Jesuits. The power, too, was exercised in both cases in a most extraordinary manner. The popes induced the crusaders to leave their wives and daughters to the care of those who were rican war. prudent enough to stay at home; and the Jesuits compelled Louis 14th to marry an old woman who had passed through many hands, but who, after all, was quite good enough for him. He repeated that, in the present intellectual improvement of the world, no country had any reason to fear the Jesuits: the press was more than a match for them; it had already beaten them down in France, and if a necessity should ever arise for such a measure, it would beat them down with equal facility in England. He then laid on the table the petition, which was from the titular bishop of Kildare, and the clergy of his diocess, against the said clause in the Roman Catholic Relief bill. The Duke of Leinster said, that as reference had been made to the establishment of the Jesuits in Ireland, he would observe that they were merely employed` there in the education of youth; that their schools were open to all persons who chose to visit them; that they were examined by the fellows of Trinity College, Dublin; and that they invited any person who pleased to inspect their system of education. Earl Grey said, he had two petitions to present, on the subject of the disfranchisement of the forty-shilling freeholders in Ireland. The first petition came from the undersigned subscribers, natives of Ireland, residing in London, and was signed by lord Killeen and several other gentlemen of great respectability. The other was from the parishes of St. Mary, St. Thomas, and St. George, Dublin. The petitioners stated the gratitude which they felt to his majesty's government, for introducing the bill for their relief, which was at last come into their lordships' House. They express their satisfaction at that bill, but regret that it should be accompanied by another bill, disfranchising, "at one fell swoop," so many as between two and three hundred thousand of their fellow-subjects. They stated many grounds of objection to such a measure. He regretted exceedingly that it should have been thought necessary to accompany the bill of relief with another bill, to which he had upon principle many serious objections. He should proceed to the disfranchisement bill, with a disposition to be relieved, if possible, from the objections which he felt to it but he could not conceal, either from himself, or from others, that to its principle there were considerable objec |