The CHAIRMAN. And before it was put in operation. Since the last bill it has been put into operation, and now it ought to be put down to the actual amount. Mr. ROBERTS. That is what I am getting at. The CHAIRMAN. I have asked the admiral to put into the hearings a statement as to the amount estimated for "clerical, drafting, inspection, and messenger service" at the Great Lakes station so that we can see what will be needed. Also, Admiral, will you state whether you need the whole of the $98,457 for the Great Lakes station? Admiral BLUE. Yes, sir. Last year there was spent for that item $1,397.76. We are estimating $1,400 for next year. We will need the whole amount asked for, as this is a large station and expensive to maintain. Mr. ROBERTS. Here is a station handling fewer men than any of the other stations, and yet the expenditure is greater. The CHAIRMAN. As a matter of fact, they have never spent the $44,000 "for clerical, drafting, inspection, and messenger service." Admiral BLUE. There is no longer any necessity for that to appear in the appropriation bill. The training station at Newport, R. I., has what no other training station has, a public-works office under the Bureau of Yards and Docks. All training stations come directly under the Bureau of Navigation, but that station has drifted off in a way and gotten partly under another bureau. It is hoped, however, that this situation may soon be remedied and the station put on the same basis as the other training stations. It is not similar to a navy yard, it is not an industrial plant that needs a public-works office. The Bureau of Navigation hands over $1,250 a month to be expended through this office, which costs the Government $14,500 a year to maintain with other appropriations. Mr. ROBERTS. What action is necessary? Admiral BLUE. It does not require congressional action. A failure to appropriate for its maintenance would accomplish the purpose. Mr. ROBERTS. In reference to the Great Lakes station, the Secretary told me that there was a naval hospital out in Chicago, and I gathered that it was in connection with this training station. Admiral BLUE. It is. Mr. ROBERTS. And that he had closed it? Admiral BLUE. Yes, sir. Mr. ROBERTS. I am right about that? Admiral BLUE. Yes, sir. Mr. ROBERTS. The hospital was built out of the appropriation as a part of this naval training station scheme and the Secretary has closed it? Admiral BLUE. Yes, sir. Mr. ROBERTS. If that is true, the maintenance of that hospital, of course, should come out of the whole appropriation for the station. The CHAIRMAN. The hospital has never been run. Mr. ROBERTS. Has there not been some estimate for maintenance? Admiral BLUE. Some of the underground steam pipes need repairing, and it ought to be kept in repair if it is ever to be of any use, and although it is not being used now, of course in case of necessity that hospital would have to be opened. Mr. WITHERSPOON. When was that completed? The CHAIRMAN. The last two years. Many years ago Congress appropriated for the establishment of this training station and the hospital as a part of the project, and the station was completed just about two years ago. They have not been running it; they have no use for it, and the Secretary closed it up to shut down the expenses. Mr. ROBERTS. Do I understand you correctly, Admiral, that the piping in this new plant is already going to pieces? Admiral BLUE. That is the report I have from the commandant of the station. He states that the conduits under barracks and quarters need constant attention. (Thereupon the committee adjourned to meet to-morrow, Wednesday, December 10, 1913, at 10.30 o'clock a. m.) COMMITTEE ON NAVAL AFFAIRS. Wednesday, December 10, 1913. The committee this day met, Hon. Lemuel P. Padgett (chairman) presiding. The CHAIRMAN. Gentlemen, we have with us again this morning Admiral Blue, Chief of the Bureau of Navigation. STATEMENT OF REAR ADMIRAL VICTOR BLUE, CHIEF BUREAU OF NAVIGATION—Continued. Mr. ROBERTS. I want to ask the admiral a question or two with regard to aviation. At present we are employing commissioned officers of the Navy who do the mechanical work of running the flying machines. In other words, we are employing these commissioned officers as mechanicians. Now, the thought has been suggested to me that we are employing too high a grade of men to do that part of the work. Of course, in actual warfare we want a commissioned officer in the machine, but we want him there to observe and to keep his eye out and see everything that can be seen and not be confined to the mechanical part of operating the machine. That work could be done just as well by any educated and trained chauffeur. In other words, that instead of having two commissioned officers in each flying machine with the consequent risk of losing both of them in case of accident, you have one commissioned officer whose sole duty is to command and tell the operator where he wants to go, and who would have nothing to do with the actual operating, and the other man would be what you might call a mechanician, a man who is a petty officer, an ordinary enlisted mechanician who has the ability to run the machine, reducing in one sense the cost of running the machine and in another sense minimizing the risk of losing the lives of men of considerable value to the Navy when men of less value could be had. The CHAIRMAN. Enlisted men? Mr. ROBERTS. Enlisted men. My idea would be to have an aviation corps and have all the mechanical part in actual operation done by men not commissioned officers. Do you get my idea, Admiral? Admiral BLUE. Yes, sir. I do not think we are sufficiently advanced to come directly to that now. I have been informed by aviators of experience that a great many of the accidents that now occur are due to the fact that nonscientific men have been flying these machines; that most of them have been unscientific men, men with mechanical skill, but not sufficiently educated in scientific principles to understand the various forces acting upon the machine while maintaining equilibrium in an air medium. Scientific flyers are required particularly at this stage in the development of the planes with a view to producing designs that will give better assurance of safety. Eventually we hope to have enlisted men flying also. When we have developed a design of machine that is comparatively safe. Mr. ROBERTS. That is my idea, to start in and educate a corps. Admiral BLUE. We are doing so now. Mr. ROBERTS. That was brought more particularly to my mind by reading in the paper about the creation of an aviation corps in the Army to consist of a certain number of commissioned officers and 250 enlisted men, I think. I did not have an opportunity to read the whole article and ascertain just what they propose, but I think they have in mind just what I am suggesting, the use of the enlisted men. They will have the men to keep the machine clean, to make repairs, and to run the machine, leaving the commissioned officer as the pilot or commander, or whatever term you might want to use the director of the machine-not committed or tied up to its actual operation, saving in that way over present methods one commissioned officer in each machine. Admiral BLUE. We are coming to the same thing. But I do not favor a separate corps entirely distinct from any other branch, to be known as the aviation corps, but I believe in training the enlisted men to become fliers, and expect soon to see them flying. We have them stationed with the machines, familiarizing themselves with their use, but as yet they do not fly; only the officers do the flying. Mr. ROBERTS. Perhaps I use the word "corps" inadvisedly. Just what phrase would you use to put these aviation men on a basis with the men whom you employ in the submarines? It is not a corps exactly; it is not a bureau. Admiral BLUE. It is all a question of detail to avation duty. Mr. ROBERTS. Men in the submarines get certain increase of pay and certain favors? Admiral BLUE. Something on the same order should be given men detailed with aeroplanes. Mr. ROBERTS. That would be my idea of the aviation branch of the service. Admiral BLUE. We do not want to separate them from the rest of the service. Mr. ROBERTS. No; I did not mean that, but they have separate duties and should have probably an increase of pay because of the hazard of the occupation. Admiral BLUE. I believe in that, thoroughly. Mr. ROBERTS. Can you see in the near future sufficient importance of aviation to have a corps such as the Signal Corps? Admiral BLUE. It might possibly come to that in the Army, but the Navy organization would hardly permit of it. If in the Navy we had a special corps of aviators an officer could not advance higher than the highest grade in that corps, which would not be very high. A regular aviation corps would not, therefore, be attractive to officers, as, no doubt, the grades in it would be limited to those of junior rank. An ambitious young officer would hardly give up his chances of commanding a battleship by entering a corps in which he could rise no higher than lieutenant or lieutenant commander. Mr. ROBERTS. And he would lose touch with the general service? Admiral BLUE. Yes, sir; he would lose touch with the general service. That is what we try to avoid in the Navy by making limited details for submarine duty and torpedo boat duty. Aviation will come under the same head. Mr. ROBERTS. Have you started to make details to this service among the enlisted men? Admiral BLUE. Yes, sir; we have a number at the aviation camp at Annapolis. This camp is transferred to Guantanamo during the winter months in order to take part in maneuvers with the fleet. Mr. ROBERTS. How large a force have you of the enlisted men now? Admiral BLUE. There are now 8 officers of the Navy, 2 marine officers, and 40 enlisted men at the aviation camp. Mr. BATHRICK. How many men in the entire service are trained. now to fly in these machines? Admiral BLUE. Fourteen officers are qualified pilots, and 240 have taken flights under instruction. During the last year 2,118 flights have been made and 1,470 passengers carried for purposes of instruction and observation. Mr. BATHRICK. Are you contemplating a larger expenditure for aviation purposes this year than last? Admiral BLUE. We are, sir. The material part of aviation does not come under my bureau, and is not provided for in my estimates, but there will be something asked for by the material bureaus concerned. The CHAIRMAN. The next item is "Naval War College, Rhode Island," and the language is the same and the amount is the same as last year. Did you have any unexpended balance last year? Admiral BLUE. No, sir; there was no unexpended balance. The CHAIRMAN. The next item is, "Naval Home, Philadelphia, Pa." I notice you are making some slight raises in the salaries, increasing one beneficiaries' attendant from $240 to $300, one assistant cook from $240 to $300, one chief laundress from $216 to $240, one head waitress from $216 to $300; you add one laborer at $420, and you estimate for one laborer at $360, instead of two laborers at $360 each, making the estimate this year $22,696, as against $22,288 appropriated last year. All of that is paid out of the naval pension fund? Admiral BLUE. Yes, sir; it is all paid out of the naval pension fund. The CHAIRMAN. The naval pension fund is the interest upon the fund that is a trust fund for the benefit of the naval personnel? Admiral BLUE. Yes, sir. These increases were made at the earnest request of the governor of the home, who submitted a letter giving his reasons in detail. The CHAIRMAN. Please put that letter in the hearings so that we can have it for consideration when we take up the items in detail. Admiral BLUE. Yes, sir. The following is the letter referred to: GOVERNOR'S OFFICE, UNITED STATES NAVAL HOME, To: Bureau of Navigation. Subject: Estimates, fiscal year 1915. (a) Bureau's letter No. 3696-228-5, of May 14, 1913. 1. The following estimates of appropriations for the Naval Home for the fiscal ending June 30, 1913, are submitted: year Water rent, heating, and lighting; cemetery, burial expenses, and headstones; Rebuilding river bulkhead. 846 846 720 720 720 720 2,700 2,700 360 420 360 360 22, 288 22, 696 In all, for Naval Home..... Which sum shall be paid out of the income from the naval pension fund. Provided, That all moneys derived from the sale of material at the Naval Home, which was originally purchased from moneys appropriated from the income from the naval pension fund, and all moneys derived from the rental of Naval Home property, shall be turned into the naval pension fund: And provided further, That all moneys belonging to a deceased beneficiary of the Naval Home or derived from the sale of his personal effects, including all such moneys now deposited in the Treasury under the act approved August 22, 1912, and which are not claimed by his legal heirs or next of kin, shall be deposited with the pay officer of the Naval Home, and if any sum so deposited has been or shall hereafter be unclaimed for a period of two years from the death of such beneficiary it shall be deposited in the Treasury to the credit of the naval pension fund, from the income of which the Naval Home is supported: And provided further, That the pensions of beneficiaries of the Naval Home shall be disposed of in |