Mr. SCHUYLER. Eighth Regiment Armory. That was my own money-$1 100. There might have been eleven hundred and some odd dollars.

The CHAIRMAN. Anything else?

Mr. SCHUYLER. You mean of my own?

The CHAIRMAN. Yes.

Mr. SCHUYLER. No; that is all I can recall so far as I am concerned.

The CHAIRMAN. For all political purposes?

Mr. SCHUYLER. As far as any other political purposes are concerned, Senator, I shall have to respectfully decline to answer.

The CHAIRMAN. All right; we will come back to that after a while. You have inquired whether we were asking about money that you had expended of your own?

Mr. SCHUYLER. Yes, sir.

The CHAIRMAN. And I answered that you have accounted here for $3,600 of your own?

Mr. SCHUYLER. Yes.

The CHAIRMAN. Did you expend or handle anybody else's money?

Mr. SCHUYLER. Yes, sir. I spent in the colored district $4,500 of Mr. Insull's money. $3,500 of that I gave to Mr. A. B. Messer and Mr. Frank Summers. Mr. Summers is colored. gave $1,000 to George Kersey.

The CHAIRMAN. Let me get that straightened out.

Mr. SCHUYLER. Yes.

The CHAIRMAN. You spent $4,500 in the colored district. that you gave to A. B. Messer?

Mr. SCHUYLER. And Frank Summers.

You said $3,500 of

The CHAIRMAN. How much of it did you give to each of them?

Mr. SCHUYLER. I gave it to them together.

The CHAIRMAN. Then you gave $1,000 to George Kersey?

Mr. SCHUYLER. To George Kersey, a colored man.

The CHAIRMAN. The other two gentlemen you named are white men?
Mr. SCHUYLER. No; Summers is colored.

The CHAIRMAN. Summers is colored?

Mr. SCHUYLER. Yes.

The CHAIRMAN. Messer is white?

Mr. SCHUYLER. Yes.

The CHAIRMAN. They were together when you gave them this money?
Mr. SCHUYLER. Yes.

The CHAIRMAN. That $1,100 you spent at the armory is not in that?

Mr. SCHUYLER. No, sir; that was my money.

The CHAIRMAN. This money you gave to Mr. Messer and Mr. Summers and Mr. Kersey, aggregating $4,500, was furnished by whom?

Mr. SCHUYLER. By Mr. Insull.

The CHAIRMAN. Who is A. B. Messer?

Mr. SCHUYLER. A. B. Messer is a citizen of Chicago, who is manager of the Foreign Language Newspaper Service. That is an organization that was primarily organized for the purpose of helping to Americanize the foreign-born people of Chicago, and when this campaign came up Mr. Insull asked me if I thought it was possible to make a campaign of education against the World Court, and I told him it was. Mr. Messer had had an experience of 30 years with foreign-language people, and I turned that campaign over to him—that is, the details of it.

The CHAIRMAN. How much of this $3,500 was employed with the foreignlanguage newspapers?

Mr. SCHUYLER. That colored money?

The CHAIRMAN. Yes.

Mr. SCHUYLER. Oh, none of that.

The CHAIRMAN. Let me understand.

You gave $4,500 to the colored districts?

Mr. SCHUYLER. That did not have anything to do with the foreign-language campaign at all.

Then the $3,500 you gave to Messer and Sum

The CHAIRMAN. Very well. mers, was that part of the $4,500?

Mr. SCHUYLER. That $3,500 was confined alone to the colored district. That is exclusive of the foreign-language campaign.

The CHAIRMAN. That is exactly it. I think you misspoke yourself. You said $3,500, of which, as I understood you, part was given. Now, I understand you gave $4,500 to the colored district, and that was Mr. Insull's money?

Mr. SCHUYLER. Yes.

The CHAIRMAN. And then you gave $3,500 to Mr. Messer and Mr. Summers? Mr. SCHUYLER. No; I meant Summers and Messer also handled that money in the colored district.

The CHAIRMAN. They also handled the $4,500?

Mr. SCHUYLER. Yes.

The CHAIRMAN. And in addition to the $4,500, you gave them $3,500?

Mr. SCHUYLER. No; that is not it.

The CHAIRMAN. Well, I have asked that twice. We will get it straight. Go ahead and let us get it straight, that is all. Let us begin all over again. You gave $4,500 to the colored district?

Mr. SCHUYLER. $4,500 was spent in the colored district.

The CHAIRMAN. Exactly.

Mr. SCHUYLER. That was disbursed in detail by Messer and Summers, all except $1,000, which was given to George Kersey. Now, that winds up the colored district, with the exception of the $1,100 which I gave myself to that meeting.

The CHAIRMAN. Now, about the foreign-language newspapers?

Mr. SCHUYLER. The foreign-language newspapers; for advertising there was spent $2,330.85.

The CHAIRMAN. Who did you say handled the foreign-language newspaper situation?

Mr. SCHUYLER. Mr. A. B. Messer.

The CHAIRMAN. The same man who had helped handle the $3,500?

Mr. SCHUYLER. Yes; although Summers was principally the man that handled that down there.

The CHAIRMAN. When was it you gave this $4,500 to the colored district? Mr. SCHUYLER. It was before the primary. I can not tell you exactly. The CHAIRMAN. Can you tell me about how long it was?

Mr. SCHUYLER. I do not believe I can.

The CHAIRMAN. Have you not any memoranda or anything from which you can tell?

Mr. SCHUYLER. I rather imagine it might have been a month or two months before primary day. It may have been a little longer than that.

The CHAIRMAN. When did you pay the money to the foreign-language newspapers that is, when did you pay it to the man who gave it to them?

Mr. SCHUYLER. That was some time before the primary. That was for plain advertising.

The CHAIRMAN. Advertising for what?

Mr. SCHUYLER. For Frank Smith.

The CHAIRMAN. Then, what other moneys did you handle?

Mr. SCHUYLER. Then I turned over from time to time during the primaryand I suppose this began four months before the primary and wound up some time before-altogether, in addition to that, $26,904.34.

The CHAIRMAN. Whom did you turn it over to?

Mr. SCHUYLER. I turned it over to Mr. Messer [handing paper to the chairman]. That is the front page of the same statement Mr. Insull handed to you. The CHAIRMAN. Then, did you have anything to do with the expenditure of this money which was turned over in the colored district, after you had turned it over?

Mr. SCHUYLER. After I had turned it over to Mr. Messer?

The CHAIRMAN. Yes.

Mr. SCHUYLER. No, sir.

The CHAIRMAN. Mr. Messer, then, is the man who will know to whom he paid it?

Mr. SCHUYLER. Yes; he will.

The CHAIRMAN. And the business or occupation or color or race of the people he gave it to?

Mr. SCHUYLER. Yes.

The CHAIRMAN. Very well.

What other moneys did you have anything to do with distributing on behalf of any other senatorial candidate than Mr. Smith? Mr. SCHUYLER. None at all.

The CHAIRMAN. You have indicated that you gave other moneys than those you have spoken of?

Mr. SCHUYLER. No.

The CHAIRMAN. Which you say went in the senatorial fight?

Mr. SCHUYLER. I did not mean to indicate that, Senator. I would merely say that I did not care to go into that.

The CHAIRMAN. What officers were you interested in?

Mr. SCHUYLER. I was not particularly interested in any of them.

The CHAIRMAN. Then whom did this money go to? I want to know whether it went to a committee?

Mr. SCHUYLER. What money?

The CHAIRMAN. The money you handled.

Mr. SCHUYLER. I did not

The CHAIRMAN. I am asking if you did not pay it to committees or committeemen?

Mr. SCHUYLER. That I shall have to decline to answer. I have told you about all the moneys that I collected and disbursed.

The CHAIRMAN. Yes. You and some other gentlemen here, I believe, think you know the scope of the authority of this committee and that you have a right to put your construction on it. Did you not receive from Samuel Insull substantial sums of money which were employed in the primary in Illinois, which was held on the 13th day of April, 1926?

Mr. SCHUYLER. I have told you about all the moneys that I received or expended in the senatorial campaign; and further than that I shall have to respectfully decline to answer.

The CHAIRMAN. Do you refuse to say whether you received other moneys and turned them over, as indicated in my last question?

Mr. SCHUYLER. Yes; I do.

The CHAIRMAN. Is it not a fact that you received substantial sums of money from Samuel Insull, which you turned over to members of political organizations that were working not only for candidates who were aspirants for county or State nominations, but also were working for Smith for the Senate?

Mr. SCHUYLER. I shall have to decline to answer.

The CHAIRMAN. I do not intend to pursue this further than to say that, of course, you understand the situation?

Mr. SCHUYLER. Yes.

The CHAIRMAN. It will be our duty to report the facts to the Senate.
Senator La Follette, do you want to ask any further questions?

Senator LA FOLLETTE. No.

The CHAIRMAN. That is all, sir.

For reasons above set forth, your committee reports the conduct of Daniel J. Schuyler while under oath before your committee.

PENNSYLVANIA

The laws and facts relating to the primary elections holden in the State of Pennsylvania on May 18, 1926, have already been set forth on pages 4 and 5 of Report 1197, Part II, of your committee, submitted December 22, 1926, which is herewith incorporated in this report and made a part hereof by reference.

THOMAS W. CUNNINGHAM

In Senate Report No. 1197, Part II, submitted December 22, 1926, touching the senatorial primary campaign in the State of Pennsylvania, on page 22 the following statement was made:

Thomas Cunningham, clerk of the court of quarter sessions of Philadelphia, and treasurer of the State Republican committee, pretends to have contributed $50,000 to the Vare campaign fund. A subpoena was issued for his appearance early in June. A diligent search failed to locate him. Finally, Representative Golder, of the fourth district of Pennsylvania, communicated with the committee, stating that Cunningham would accept service. His whereabouts was disclosed and he was served. He appeared before your committee in its session in the Federal Building in the city of Chicago on July 29, 1926. With him appeared Representative Benjamin M. Golder, who stated that Mr. Cunningham had requested that he be permitted to attend as his attorney. Mr. Cunningham, both for himself and through his attorney, protested the jurisdiction of your committee and refused to answer questions put to him and denied the committee

any information beyond the following facts of his name, residence, and occupation as clerk of the quarter sessions court; that he contributed $25,000 to the Vare campaign fund through Thomas F. Watson on April 10, 1926, and $25,000 on April 13.

His testimony is here reproduced in full and made a part of this report for such action as the Senate may deem proper:

TESTIMONY OF THOMAS W. CUNNINGHAM

(The witness was sworn by the chairman.)

The CHAIRMAN. Let the record show the appearance of Mr. Golder.

Mr. GOLDER. Mr. Chairman, in the event that a question is asked which I consider one which Mr. Cunningham should not answer, may I address myself to the Chair or to Mr. Cunningham?

The CHAIRMAN. It would be entirely proper for you to address yourself to the Chair and state your objection, the same as you would to a court.

What is your full name, Mr. Cunningham?

Mr. CUNNINGHAM. Thomas W. Cunningham.

The CHAIRMAN. Where do you reside?

Mr. CUNNINGHAM. 2116 Cherry Street, Philadelphia.

The CHAIRMAN. How long have you resided in Philadelphia?

Mr. CUNNINGHAM. My whole life.

The CHAIRMAN. What is your occupation or business?

Mr. CUNNINGHAM. Clerk of the quarter sessions court.

The CHAIRMAN. With what political organization were you connected during

the recent primary in Pennsylvania—the last primary?

Mr. CUNNINGHAM. The Republican organization of Philadelphia County. The CHAIRMAN. Who was the chairman of that organization?

Mr. CUNNINGHAM. Thomas F. Watson.

The CHAIRMAN. And what candidate for the Senate was that organization supporting?

Mr. CUNNINGHAM. Congressman Vare-W. S. Vare.

The CHAIRMAN. Did you collect any money for use in that campaign?
Mr. CUNNINGHAM. I did not.

The CHAIRMAN. Was any money given to you for use in that campaign?

Mr. CUNNINGHAM. Not one cent.

The CHAIRMAN. I mean to include in money, of course, checks or drafts or anything

Mr. CUNNINGHAM. No check, no drafts, or anything.

The CHAIRMAN. That you got money on?

Mr. CUNNINGHAM. No, sir.

The CHAIRMAN. Did you handle any money in that campaign?

Mr. CUNNINGHAM. I did not.

The CHAIRMAN. Did you deliver any money to any person?

Mr. CUNNINGHAM. I did.

The CHAIRMAN. That is handling money, Mr. Cunningham?

Mr. CUNNINGHAM. I did not catch your way of saying that.

The CHAIRMAN. Very well. To whom did you give any money?

Mr. CUNNINGHAM. I handed money to Thomas F. Watson, $25,000, on the 10th day of April, 1926.

The CHAIRMAN. Where did you get that money?

Mr. CUNNINGHAM. I got that money out of my own private funds.

The CHAIRMAN. How is that?

Mr. CUNNINGHAM. Out of my own private funds.

The CHAIRMAN. Your own private moneys?

Mr. CUNNINGHAM. Yes, sir; my own money; my own money.

The CHAIRMAN. How long had it been your own money?

Mr. GOLDER. Mr. Chairman, may I state an objection at this time?

The CHAIRMAN. You may.

Mr. GOLDER. I have advised Mr. Cunningham that, in my judgment, this committee has no jurisdiction to inquire into the primary election held in Pennsylvania; that it is only a local matter for the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania; and that in my professional judgment he can answer those questions which he sees fit dealing with the primary election, and that he may refuse to answer those questions which he considers his own personal business. I have further advised Mr. Cunningham that he need not disclose to this committee from what part of his personal estate, or personal fortune, he paid the money to Mr. Watson that he did pay during this last campaign in Pennsylvania.

1

I thought I would state that as a matter of record so that I would not have to object each time a question was asked.

The CHAIRMAN. What was my last question?

(The question was read by the reporter as follows:)

"The CHAIRMAN. How long had it been your own money?"

Mr. CUNNINGHAM. I refuse to answer that question, Senator, as a personal question. It is my own private business.

The CHAIRMAN. Where did you get this $25,000 you say you gave to Mr. Watson?

Mr. CUNNINGHAM. I refuse to answer that question! I think that is personal. The CHAIRMAN. Where were you keeping this $25,000 before you gave it to Mr. Watson?

Mr. CUNNINGHAM. That is another personal question, Senator. I refuse to answer it.

The CHAIRMAN. Did you give this money to Mr. Watson in cash or by check? Mr. CUNNINGHAM. I gave it to him as cash.

The CHAIRMAN. Where were you when you gave it to him?

Mr. CUNNINGHAM. I took it down to his headquarters at the Walton Hotel on the 10th day of April.

t

The CHAIRMAN. Did you have it in your pocket when you gave it to himbefore you gave it to him?

Mr. CUNNINGHAM. Yes, sir.

The CHAIRMAN. Where did you get it from to put in your pocket?

Mr. CUNNINGHAM. That is a personal question, and I decline to answer it.

The CHAIRMAN. How long had you had this money in your possession?

Mr. CUNNINGHAM. That is another personal question, and I decline to answer it. It was my own money, and I do not think I should tell the public where I kept it and how I got, or anything else about it.

The CHAIRMAN. How long have you been clerk of the quarter sessions court? Mr. CUNNINGHAM. Twenty-one years the 1st of January, 1926.

The CHAIRMAN. What is the salary of that position?

Mr. CUNNINGHAM. $8,000 a year.

The CHAIRMAN. Was this money which you refer to as the $25,000 that you gave to Watson, savings from your salary?

Mr. CUNNINGHAM. That is another personal question. I can not answer that. The CHAIRMAN. Unfortunately, a good many questions are personal.

Mr. CUNNINGHAM. Yes. I think a man's own money is one of his own personal privileges, and he is not supposed to tell how he got it or how he saved it. I think that is a rather unfair question to ask me, how I got the money, how I saved it, and what I done with it.

The CHAIRMAN. I dare say. Is there anything wrong or wicked or crooked about the way you got this money, so that it will embarrass you to answer the question or will subject you to criminal prosecution?.

Mr. GOLDER. I think that is an unfair question, Senator, and I advise Mr. Cunningham to disregard it.

The CHAIRMAN. If you were to answer the questions I have asked you with regard to the sources from which and the way in which this money came to you, would it tend to subject you to criminal prosecution or public contempt or obloquy?

Mr. GOLDER. Senator Reed, I think that question is objectionable in form and the way in which it is put, and I advise Mr. Cunningham not to consider it, or not to answer it.

The CHAIRMAN. Do you refuse to answer, Mr. Cunningham?

Mr. CUNNINGHAM. Yes; I refuse to answer.

Mr. GOLDER. You see, Senator, when you ask a question which you know that I have advised Mr. Cunningham not to answer, and put it in such a way as you have, it necessarily implies something which is unsavory, and I think it is an unfair way for you to treat a witness.

The CHAIRMAN. Well, now, we have permitted you to sit here as an act of courtesy, but we will not permit any criticism of the committee from you.

Mr. GOLDER. Senator Reed, you have permitted Mr. Cunningham to have his attorney here, and I assume you will not compel me to advise Mr. Cunningham except as I think best.

The CHAIRMAN. You will maintain a respectful and decent attitude or you will not sit at this table very long as anybody's attorney.

Mr. GOLDER. Senator Reed, I have the utmost respect for the committee and for its membership.