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Admiral STANFORD. I should not have said "surplus." The yards are equipped with locomotives, locomotive cranes, and cars; there is also in each yard a very large crane used in operations around the dry dock, usually with a capacity of 40 or 50 tons. With the increase in the number of dry docks and the development of the yards there has been an increase in the number of cranes, because of the very large saving that they make in the handling of heavy materials. Cranes are legitimately kept in repair under this appropriation "maintenance."

Mr. BUCHANAN. Not only legitimate, but essential?

Admiral STANFORD. Absolutely essential. A great many parts of the cranes are subject to wear and they have to be kept in good condition. It means a considerable expenditure, an increasing expenditure, to keep the cranes in proper working order.

Mr. BUCHANAN. Is it possible that you have to rely upon some surplus funds to keep the cranes and equipment of the yard in first-class repair? Why is it necessary to use the surplus of some other fund to repair the cranes?

Admiral STANFORD. The surplus of another fund has not been used, but additional money under "maintenance" is necessary to provide for this increasing demand. It is not proposed to use another appropriation. I think you misunderstood me.

Mr. BUCHANAN. Do you usually have a sufficient amount to keep the equipment in good condition?

Admiral STANFORD. Requests from the yards for funds for that purpose are never denied; the regular yard allotments from the appropriation are as a rule sufficient for the purpose. The bureau makes every effort to keep all such equipment in good condition.

The CHAIRMAN. As I understood you, it was an illustration for the purpose of showing the working of this item. This general head embraces a great many items, and you estimate the various subitems that go into it at so much, and the aggregate was $1,500,000 for last year. Now, in the expenditure if you find that you have overestimated, say, for one item a little amount and underestimated from the exigencies of the wear and tear of another item, out of the general sum you may use the excess of one to meet the deficiency in the other under the general appropriation "maintenance" which takes up the $1,500,000?

Admiral STANFORD. That is the idea.

Mr. HOBSON. A part of this fund is available for expenditure, under the direction of the Secretary of the Navy, for clerical, inspection, drafting, messenger, and other classified work in the navy yards and naval stations, $425,000. That is not changed from last year? Admiral STANFORD. I think not.

Mr. HOBSON. Is not that a rather large proportion of the total? Admiral STANFORD. I do not think it excessive; in fact, considering the results accomplished, it seems very small.

Mr. BATHRICK. It is about 25 per cent of the total, is it not?

Mr. ROBERTS. Out of the $425,000 you have to make plans for all the piers, bulkheads, sewers, conduits, water systems, and all that sort of thing?

Admiral STANFORD. The office at the bureau in conjunction with the offices of the public works departments at the yards make all plans. Some plans are prepared at the yards, because they are in

better position for their picparation; they have the local data that is essential and which can be more readily utilized than would be the case if the work were done at the bureau. On the other hand, such work as the preparation of plans for dry docks

Mr. ROBERTS (interposing). Comes out of the $425,000, whether done at the yard or in Washington?

Admiral STANFORD. Yes, sir.

Mr. HOBSON. Glance at the proportionate part under the Bureau of Equipment, pages 43 and 44. Their total is something over $5,000,000, and yet they ask that only $260,000 of that be available for this particular item.

The CHAIRMAN. The Bureau of Equipment is a purchasing bureau, and the other is a working bureau.

Mr. HOBSON. They must have clerical work; not so much drafting, but a great deal of bookkeeping. You specify clerical, inspecting, drafting, messenger, and other classified work in the navy yards and naval stations. Under "equipment" it is for clerical, drafting, inspection, and messenger service at the several navy yards and naval stations and coaling stations. I recognize, so far as drafting is concerned, that it is associated with manufacturing; but under the words "and other classified work" that is very broad. That is not included under "equipment." Do you know just what the other classified work would include?

Admiral STANFORD. I can not state offhand.

Mr. HOBSON. In other words, I am not questioning at all the accuracy or advisability of it, but I should like a little more itemized information.

The CHAIRMAN. Please give us a statement of the number of employees and their salaries paid out of this $425,000.

Mr. HOBSON. A little more than that, Mr. Chairman. Please give us, not so much in detail either, a statement of the expenditures under that item for last year.

Admiral STANFORD. The total value of work performed by the Bureau of Yards and Docks during the fiscal year 1912, including that done for other bureaus, amounted to $9,500,818.98. Total expenditure for office work during the year amounted to $293,186.26, or less than 3.1 per cent of the total expenditure. Considering that office work includes all work of design, as well as superintendence, in connection with not only new constructions, but also repair and maintenance of old structures, and also considerable expense for clerks in the commandant's, captain of yards, and accounting officer's offices, and for other nonproductive employees and a multitude of other military expenditures, the office costs seem very low indeed, and are considered very creditable.

The CHAIRMAN. The total at the bottom of page 74 for last year was $4,623,300, and the amount asked this year is $6,526,445. The $425,000 that is appropriated in this item is for the pay of the clerical service that is, doing the work that is provided for by this total appropriation of four or five million dollars?

Admiral STANFORD. To which should be added repairs and maintenance and work for other bureaus.

Mr. ROBERTS. Is it not also true, Admiral, that your bureau has to look after certain plans, construction, and so on, for other bureaus of the department, in addition to the appropriations for the plans and superintendence?

Admiral STANFORD. That is true. Last year the allotments from other bureaus amounted to $856,645.44.

Mr. ROBERTS. And the total amount for your bureau does not indicate, by any means, the amount that would be taken out of the $425,000 for plans, superintendence, and construction?

Admiral STANFORD. That is right. We are now building three hospitals, one at Portsmouth, one at Chelsea, and one at Newport, at a cost of something over $800,000. That money is obtained from the Bureau of Medicine and Surgery. We also have done a great deal of work in the construction of the Arlington wireless equipment, masts, power plant, and the various appurtenances to that station.

Mr. ROBERTS. Really what is paid out of this $425,000 should not properly all be charged against your bureau; it is done for the benefit of other bureaus ?

Admiral STANFORD. As shown above, the amount for office expense was 3.1 per cent of the total amount handled in the year 1912, and included expenditures on account of work performed for other bureaus.

Mr. HOBSON. When you do a piece of work for another bureau, while the construction is charged against the other bureau, the superintendence and inspection is met out of this fund?

Admiral STANFORD. In every case.

Mr. HOBSON. You do not charge that against the other bureau for whom you do the work?

Admiral STANFORD. No.

The CHAIRMAN. In regard to the wireless equipment, we made a special appropriation for that. It was supposed to be done by line officers, men especially fitted, so we were told. Do I understand that your bureau, the Bureau of Yards and Docks, has been doing that work?

Admiral STANFORD. That appropriation, if I remember aright, is $1,000,000.

The CHAIRMAN. The authorization is $1,000,000 and the appropriation $400,000.

Admiral STANFORD. The masts, buildings, and constructions which will be handled by the Bureau of Yards and Docks it is estimated will amount to about $750,000 out of the total of $1,000,000, leaving onequarter of the amount for the wireless apparatus and the materials which are peculiar to the wireless equipment.

Mr. Foss. When was that appropriation made?

Admiral STANFORD. That appropriation became available upon the passage of the bill last August.

Mr. HOBSON. What bureau is charged with that work?

Admiral STANFORD. By law the Bureau of Equipment; funds are held under the Secretary's office. The Bureau of Steam Engineering has general charge of the wireless development. They are going a little slow in the expenditure of the fund in order to benefit by information from the operation of the Arlington equipment to guide them in making the designs for these other large stations. There has been very little work done so far using those funds.

Mr. BATHRICK. To make it plain to myself, do I understand that after we have authorized $1,000,000 to build a wireless station that the $1,000,000 is not all it will cost, but you are supposed to contribute funds from your bureau for the work?

Admiral STANFORD. No. The expense for office work performed by the Bureau of Yards and Docks upon the work will be paid from Yards and Docks funds.

Mr. BATHRICK. Do they pay over to your bureau money for the work which they employ you to do?

Admiral STANFORD. The materials and labor actually expended in construction work will come from the million dollars which you authorized.

Mr. BATHRICK. Then if we appropriate $1,000,000 for Admiral Cone's bureau to do this work

Admiral STANFORD (interposing). His bureau will request the Bureau of Yards and Docks to design and erect the masts and the buildings and the public-works features of the installation.

Mr. HOBSON. How much of the work is under contract?

Admiral STANFORD. It will all probably be done by contract. As far as I know, in the Arlington installation there was no direct yard labor or Government labor employed.

Mr. HOBSON. Except inspection?

Admiral STANFORD. Except inspection. It was all contract work. The CHAIRMAN. Your bureau prepares the designs and specifications and furnishes the superintendence?

Admiral STANFORD. Yes, sir.

Mr. ROBERTS. That is not charged against the $1,000,000?

Admiral STANFORD. The cost of preparation of the plans and inspection for the public-works portion is not.

Mr. Foss. The expenditure of how much money went through your bureau for this-about $750,000 out of the $1,000,000?

Admiral STANFORD. About three-quarters will, we estimate.
Mr. Foss. Will go through your bureau?

Admiral STANFORD. Yes, sir.

Mr. Foss. Why should not this work be under your bureau if you expend the money and get up the plans?

Admiral STANFORD. It was not arranged that way.

Mr. Foss. What is the special reason that a line officer should be charged with this appropriation and then turn the whole matter over to another bureau to perform the work?

Mr. ROBERTS. The same reason that when you appropriate for a post-office building to be utilized and occupied by the Post Office Department the Treasury Department builds it and gets it ready and turns it over to them.

Mr. HOBSON. Is there any large amount of inspection conducted by the Bureau of Steam Engineering along with your inspection?

Admiral STANFORD. The Bureau of Steam Engineering has officers located in different manufacturing centers for instance, one at Brooklyn, one at Pittsburgh, and one at Chicago-and all inspection work that is required by the Bureau of Yards and Docks in those districts is as far as possible performed by the Steam Engineering inspectors. For instance, we may have a turbine under construction at the Westinghouse shops at Pittsburgh; the inspection is made by the engineering inspectors in that vicinity. We do not have a special inspector for that work.

Mr. BATHRICK. The appropriation asked for by the Bureau of Steam Engineering will not cover the cost of that station?

Admiral STANFORD. Not according to present arrangements, unless when the works are completed there will remain a balance unobligated which will be sufficient to offset the sums spent by Yards and Docks from funds under that bureau.

Mr. BATHRICK. And the committee, in that case, did not know then what the station would cost under the estimate?

Mr. HOBSON. For that kind of work, what is your experience as to the proportion of the total cost involved in designing, drafting, and inspection? Would it be as much as the architect's percentage? Admiral STANFORD. It is materially less than would be the case if we contracted with architects for the service, very materially less. Mr. BUCHANAN. Is this the usual custom in the construction of buildings for the navy yards, or did it just apply to these wireless

towers?

Admiral STANFORD. As a rule, the public works appropriations are made to the Bureau of Yards and Docks and the bureau handles the work initially and designs to meet the approval of the department or the station which is to use the improvement.

Mr. BUCHANAN. What I mean is the expense of this designing. Is it usually charged to this fund that you have charged it to the appropriation for the building, etc.?

Admiral STANFORD. All expense connected with the design and superintendence of all public works is paid from "maintenance."

Mr. HOBSON. And also please furnish us with a statement of what part of the $425,000 was actually expended for work authorized under other bureaus.

Admiral STANFORD. About $27,000. I might have added, in speaking of work which the bureau does for other bureaus, that in connection with the construction of coaling stations and fuel-oil tanks and pipe lines which is performed from allotments for "Depots for coal." We are constructing a coaling station at Pearl Harbor at a cost of $300,000 and oil tanks at a cost of $45,000. There have recently been additional allotments made for the mechanical equipment of the coaling station and for additional tanks. There is also much work of similar character in progress at other stations.

The CHAIRMAN. In other words, the drafting force in your office, which is paid out of this $425,000, and the designing force, which is paid out of this $425,000, perform work in various bureaus for the entire Navy Department?

Admiral STANFORD. Yes, sir; as regards public works.

Mr. TALBOTT. Could it be improved on? If we should take that work of drafting away from your bureau and put it somewhere else, would there be any improvement?

Admiral STANFORD. There has been some confusion in keeping accounts under the appropriation "Depots for coal," which was formerly handled by the Bureau of Equipment; but I think an order will be issued very soon transferring that account to the Bureau of Yards and Docks, so that the fund will then be handled just exactly as though appropriated for the Bureau of Yards and Docks.

Mr. TALBOTT. It is your opinion that the method you are pursuing now is as good as any other to carry on this work?

Admiral STANFORD. Heretofore in the case of the wireless work I think the reason for not dividing the appropriation into two parts, one for the Bureau of Steam Engineering and the other for the Bureau

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